Through The Creative Door

7 | Little by Little with Ida Sophia

In this episode, Alexis step’s into the deeply immersive world of South Australian-born, Berlin-based artist Ida Sophia. Known for her evocative performance art, as well as her work in media and sculpture, Ida shares the discipline and solitude that shape her creative process. From her durational performance Regret to the significance of journaling as a "moving studio," this conversation is a raw and inspiring exploration of what it means to create with intention.
More info: https://www.idasophia.art
If you’d like to see more, you can follow Ida on instagram; @ idasophia_art
 
This episode was recorded on 1st March 2025 on the lands of the Kaurna Peoples. We hope that this episode inspires you as a creative person and as a human being.
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for creative people to share their story and inspire others. Have you got someone in mind who would love to have a chat? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
Creative resources from Ida:
Book: Letters To A Young Poet by Rainer Maria Rilke
Let’s get social:
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TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
00:09 - Alexis (Host)
Hello, my name is Alexis Naylor and I am your host here at Through the Creative Door. On behalf of myself and my guests, I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. Owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. May we pay our respects to all First Nations people and acknowledge Elders, past and present. On this podcast, I'll be chatting to an array of creative guests, getting a glimpse into their worlds and having some honest and inspiring conversations along the way. I'm delighted to welcome you to Through the Creative Door,
 
00:42
Ida. I am so chuffed. Thank you so much for coming through the creative door. I actually just have no words. I have, I mean, as I wouldn't be doing my due diligence if I hadn't done a little stalky, stalk of you, but there's actually no words. Like, I've seen some of your beautiful performance art and it's so emotive and so thought-provoking. And I know that's not all that you do, because you also obviously do amazing sculptures which, for those listening, we're sitting in front of one of your artworks. What did you say? This one's called. 
 
01:31 - Ida (Guest)
This is called contact failure. 
 
01:34 - Alexis (Host)
Yes, I'm going to put a pin in that because I want to circle back, because I think that's super interesting, and I know that there's another component to this that's living in another room, so I want to unpack that a little bit. But yeah, I mean, it seems to me that the landscape of you as an artist is like so fluid and there's so many mediums that you sort of draw upon. Um, what does a creative space mean to you and why? 
 
02:01 - Ida (Guest)
yeah, I mean it needs to have a level of isolation for me. I need to be able to, you know, close the door and to to enter it, um, almost in a monastic sense. I have a very Um disciplined studio um practice. I like to be in the studio by 8am, even earlier, if I can be. I'm just obsessed. 
 
02:29
I at the moment, my studio is in a basement and I bound down the stairs so excited with my little thermos of coffee and my journal under my arm, ready to go into the studio and continue working from one whatever project or multiple projects that I'm working on right now. Um, but I'm actually in a residency and over the course of my practice, I've done multiple residencies and that has been so um, it's been so beautiful to be around other artists consistently whilst having this very isolated, monastic practice within a community. So I kind of need both. I need to be able to step into it, close the door, have that whole world and then be able to open the door, have lots of people come in, be connected to community, have a lot of experiences. Uh, wherever that residency is situated, um, right now it's in Berlin, which is what a city to do a residency in. There's like 300 plus galleries. 
 
03:34
It's uh, the studio is in the city is the city, I should say yeah, it's really taught me about going beyond those four walls of my studio and and recognizing that, uh, practice is is in the looking, the listening, the feeling, the, the seeking, uh out what a city can actually provide for you artistically on the pulse yeah yeah, yeah, totally. So I think energy in that way is important Energy, excited energy and then very concentrated energy, it's both. 
 
04:16 - Alexis (Host)
I love this question because in some ways, it doesn't matter what kind of baseline I think we're all sort of trying to find. It's like the yin and yang of creativity within a space and uh, yeah, what a beautiful answer. Beautiful answer, I mean. You have, your body of work is massive and your mediums are across the board. Is there a body of work or a piece of work that you're most proud of creating, and how did it come about? 
 
04:52 - Ida (Guest)
yeah, I think I'm most proud of creating Regret from 2021. This work is a 28 day dur performance, six hours a day. Every day, I sat in a chair and I watched this monumental installation of flowers decompose, and I did that because I regretted not spending the last month of my father's life by his side and I wanted to spend the time in the work that I wish I had spent with him, but not only that. Again, realizing that my story is a common story, you know, a regret is something that a lot of people feel. I had a participatory element where I cast these little plaster pieces that people could write their regrets on, and my, my um vow was to hold the literal and um metaphorical weight of that regret after they placed it on a hook on the garment that I was wearing a cloak thing that you're wearing. 
 
05:59
Yeah, yeah, and this work. The reason I'm so proud of it is that I was the first day I did it, for sitting there for six hours I thought, oh my God, what have I done? This is really hard, but I'd done the training, I'd done the endurance training, I'd done the mental training before, and when I got to the end of it, I felt like I could continue doing it for three months. You know, even though this thing on me had got to about 15 or 20 kilos, I felt so light. 
 
06:28
You know, I didn't realize, or I didn't know with empirical evidence, that durational time in performance could really be so effective on myself and the people that shared this work with me. You know, people showed me that they needed spaces to come and, um, be able to be with their stuff that are, you know, non-religious or you know. So I understood that, uh, through durational performance, there was some kind of gift there, given that people can come and have an experience, go away, think about it. The show is still going. I'm still there, I'm still holding the space, still holding their regret, and then they can come back in that revisited state where they've, where they've carried it as well, and it was a beautiful. It was a beautiful thing. It really taught me what I was capable of and um, what I needed to do with my practice, what my duty is as an artist to do with my practice. 
 
07:34 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, it's so. It's beautiful to hear you articulate what it was like in that space physically, because the photos of that time, of that that performance, like they're striking, they're really striking and so for someone who's paletting it, who wasn't in the room to feel that you know, wash over them, they're very emotionally triggering images, knowing the context. Yeah, and that, yeah, super powerful. 
 
08:08
Yeah, yeah, thank you yeah, thank you so much for being so gracious and sharing that. That's, yeah, it's a good question, beautiful. On the flip side of things that you're proud of, have you had an experience or a situation that's challenged your creativity? 
 
08:30 - Ida (Guest)
I've had a really blessed artistic life and I think my challenges are the source of the best parts of my practice, so maybe I don't see them as challenges so much. 
 
08:48
I think all of the things that I work through in my different works are based on the challenges of early childhood, as so many are like interpersonal, inter-familial things that that arose, and I think the challenge perhaps is being so candid and so vulnerable in order to revisit, feel it again, extract it out of you into your right hand, look at it, understand it, understand where you are now and you're not that child, and look at it from a different world view and from an art perspective and from a translation perspective and and from a a truth perspective. You know, can I actually do something with this or am I ready to? And then, of course, translating that into into a work, into materiality, um, so there are lots of things that I know are still locked up. Um, that will take time, I think. But yeah, I think the challenge is is is the really the, the going in and doing the revisitation of some of the things that you're like, oh, that one's painful, but it's, but that's, that's okay. Does that answer your question? 
 
10:30 - Alexis (Host)
it does, it does very much. So, okay, good, considering that you change workspaces, the studio space, I'm curious is there anything like an object or a thing that you can't live without when you're creating? Of course, of course. What is this thing? 
 
10:52 - Ida (Guest)
I'm a prolific journaler. Okay thing, I'm a prolific journaler, so it's a absolute essential for me and I don't feel complete if my journal is not with me at all times. I've journaled since maybe I was about six and I must have hundreds of A5 journals. There's mine just there, within, within the eyesight. 
 
11:14 - Alexis (Host)
I have to have it there is there a particular kind of like? 
 
11:18 - Ida (Guest)
blank paper, a5, that's okay. Okay, it changes, you know, over the years. But, um, the thing with the journal is that it is, it is the moving studio, because I'm, because I'm moving around all the time and I don't think that we we switch off being an artist when we're in the studio and when we're being out of the studio. It's just not, it's not a thing, it's not. It's not in our wheelhouse that we have a nine to five. I don't think that it ever fully goes away or that perhaps people don't understand that we stop being artists. We don't stop being artists, pardon me, at at any time. 
 
11:57
Um, we're experiencing the world as artists and gathering and collecting and, uh, the journal is this, uh, deeply supportive space that holds the constancy of artisthood throughout every minute of my day, even like just a few days ago, I finally had this huge realization about this theme of hope in my entire practice. 
 
12:22
It is the, it is this, this word that has driven everything we do in our life with this, this hope that we, we hope someone will do something, we hope that we'll get this, we hope that they'll love us, we hope that they'll forgive us. All of this has driven all of our behavior and all of my work, and you know this. This light comes on, it's an idle Tuesday afternoon at 2 45 in the afternoon and you're like, oh my god, I've got to write this down immediately and for me it's a. I think the second object that's very important to me is my lame pen that I write with, because writing my phone is just, it's not a thing, it's almost not fast enough. My hand is quicker and I need the connection between my, my brain and my arm and my hand to to, to think and deliver exactly what it is, um. So yeah, definitely recommend having a lemme pen for all of the all of the journaling I
 
13:29 - Alexis (Host)
I really agree with that as a lyricist and a songwriter. There's something about the notation and it's this um. So we spoke off mark about how I got diagnosed with complex regional pain syndrome a couple of years ago and I talked to people about one of my major struggles around that was the physicality that I lacked and that was I couldn't. I had to learn how to write again. 
 
13:50
Yeah, I'm right-handed so I had to learn how to ride again. I couldn't play piano and it's like that, that physicality of letting it flow through my body to allow whatever was you know the synapsis in my brain to snap and go through. That was the struggle, that was so hard. So I yeah, it's, it's, yeah. You can be in another state of mind when you know your body can just flow, it can flow through to your hand]
 
14:19 - Ida (Guest)
 and the determination for you to go, this is absolutely essential for me and my expression, like handwriting, is such a it's such a thing that is only ours. Um, I can imagine that that is something that you were absolutely, uncompromisingly not going to let go stubborn, some would say good, good that's. I mean, that's the only way that you, that you get yeah through it, yeah, and you still are every day right yeah, it's a practice that's right for a reason. 
 
14:55 - Alexis (Host)
Now, if you could give one piece of gold, one nugget of advice to another creative or another human being, what would it be? 
 
15:04 - Ida (Guest)
oh, I think, always in the back of my head, and maybe because this is because I'm such a virgo the, the quote, or the, the um, what should I call it? The, the way of thinking through everything that I do is, little by little, a little becomes a lot. This, this compound gesture like why, why I work through with durational time, it's the compound of every single hour, every single minute, every single day that that makes the powerfulness of the piece. Or, you know, doing all of the, the admin, that we have to do as 21st century. 
 
15:40
It's ridiculous artists you know, little by little, little becomes a lot. It's it's when you have really ambitious projects, um, you know they just take they to hold them. You have to hold just a tiny bit at a time, and that it has been the the greatest lesson that I. I just have to take one little bite at a time. Well said, well even in, even in this, in the self-talk. You know, you get into the studio in the morning and sometimes you can feel like you really doubt everything that you've done. Maybe it should all just go in the bin. And it's like one little thought, that's like no, I know what I'm doing, I'm here, I've showed up for the studio, and then that thought becomes another good thought and it sort of builds up and then it just becomes total, uh, excitement to be there. One little thought rolling after the other. 
 
16:35
So, yeah, it's kind of um, essential, yeah, yeah yeah, and it's self-propelling too builds on each, precisely, precisely the momentum of that, like you can catch the wave and then all of a sudden you're doing this enormous thing and you're like, oh that that wasn't so hard. 
 
16:56 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, I love that feeling. 
 
16:58 - Ida (Guest)
Yeah, how good is it yeah. 
 
16:59 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, cool, yeah, yeah, I did that, I did that. 
 
17:02 - Ida (Guest)
I'm here. 
 
17:03 - Alexis (Host)
Ready to receive. 
 
17:04 - Ida (Guest)
Yeah, yes, yeah, totally, totally. 
 
17:08 - Alexis (Host)
I'm curious, if someone wanted to do what you do, would you have any advice or recommendations on courses or books or, I don't know, any sort of content that someone could palette in to sort of develop their creative process and even come close to what you do? 
 
17:35 - Ida (Guest)
well, I mean specifically for durational performance. I think that, um, figuring out, uh, uh, how to uh expand your endurance capacity physically and mentally is the first step. You know to take an eight hour walk, you know, and you know to sit and just listen for 30 minutes, you know, these little things can build up your endurance and are really it's really physical. So that's the practice total physical health and an alignment and building that up slowly, slowly, doing semi hard things for a long time. So that's very practical. But I think I I think the sort of philosophical or mental side of being an artist requires much more work and much more nourishment. 
 
18:45
And the greatest resource I think I could recommend is a book called Letters to a Young Poet, which you might know, by Rena Maria Rilke, who is a German poet. His poetry is extraordinary. However, this book is a one-sided correspondence, it's just the letters from Rilke to another poet, and it is essentially about solitude and how we must not fear it but know that it is the absolute, necessary aspect of unlocking that which is so deep within us as artistic people. And it is absolutely heart-wrenchingly open. And oh, he says things like if there are abysses, let them be our abysses. These, these sorts of lines that you just think, my god, I, I can understand why being alone is so important to um what I can do in the world with people. So read that and then read it again, read it every month. It's a constant next to me with my journal, I think yeah, yeah, yeah. 
 
20:08 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my goodness, it's, I feel like, in regards to like, yeah, exactly what you were saying about, yeah, as an artist, it's like looking after ourselves as a whole human being to be able to serve as an artist, yeah, and like, yeah, taking in, yeah, all of these bits Absolutely To feed that. 
 
20:30 - Ida (Guest)
I'm really against any struggling or starving artist tropes, I think oh my goodness, me too I think it's an absolute um travesty that any of us should ever have to hear that will be placed in that category, um and what we can do within that. You know, I'm referencing rilke. He's he's reminding us that our, our struggle is is our actually our power? You know, making artistic work is a struggle, but it's the it's the struggle we choose. 
 
21:03 - Alexis (Host)
So, therefore, choose your hard right that's right, that's right. 
 
21:06 - Ida (Guest)
So it's, it's um, quite a, quite a privilege to be able to, to wrangle all of this out of, out of ourselves and um, and that requires living a very different lifestyle and life to many other careers and we choose it because we can't do anything else. You know, it is, we know, and yeah, and it's ups and downs, arounds, throughs and unders, and I choose it all, yeah. 
 
21:41 - Alexis (Host)
Wow, you're speaking my language, lady. You're speaking my language. I've tried to bow away from it before and I'm a lesser of a human because of it. 
 
21:48 - Ida (Guest)
Right. 
 
21:49 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah. 
 
21:50 - Ida (Guest)
Can't put you in a box. 
 
21:51 - Alexis (Host)
Nope, Nope. Shred doesn't work. You've broke it. I want to be on top of the box. 
 
21:56 - Ida (Guest)
I want to be around it, I'm gonna throw the bugs. Yeah, I'm gonna take it apart, I'm gonna make it a circle. Now I want to be different colors. Yes, yes, lighting, oh my god, but that's it. That's our life. 
 
22:12 - Alexis (Host)
It's quite special yeah, we're really lucky. My goodness, you are such a joy and thank you so much for being so gracious and sharing just a little piece of yourself in today's interview. 
 
22:27 - Ida (Guest)
I just yeah thank you, thanks for making the time for me. 
 
22:31 - Alexis (Host)
I do have one last question, mm-hmm. If you could hear another creative come onto this podcast and answer these questions, who would you throw under the bus? Who would you like to hear? 
 
22:43 - Ida (Guest)
It's a no-brainer for me. I would suggest Joseph James Francis, who is a sound artist and sculptor. Who is a sound artist and sculptor and he has an incredible approach to to what sound can be in in our lives and how it can change the experience of us walking through it. I think he's got some incredible research that is behind his practice and a really interesting history. Of course, I'm super biased. We collaborate all the time and he made the sound works for Witness. He did the sound work for Regret as well. He's an extraordinary creative and I think he has so much to contribute to our contemporary art dialogue. 
 
23:36 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, Wow, I will try and pin him down. Hopefully he's ready to receive me and I can bail him out with questions. Right, let's do it. I'll be like you can put a good word in for me, yeah yeah. Amazing. Oh my goodness, Ada, thank you so much for this beautiful chat. 
 
23:58
this has just filled my cup yeah, me too yay thanks for tuning in for another episode of through the creative door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffee.com/throughthecreativedoor or by the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favorite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community and we'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

BSIDE Sunshower by Couch

Featured Artist: Couch
Featured Vinyl: Sunshower
 
Alexis’ Hot Pick 
Jessie
Sam’s Hot Pick
L.A.
 
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for an artist's vinyl to listen to, have you got one in mind that we should check out? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Co-Host: Sam Timmerman
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Voiceover: Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
 
00:09 - Intro
Welcome to B-Side, the mini-series from Through the Creative Door. Join Alexis and Sam as they dive into the timeless world of vinyl. For Alexis, vinyl was more than music. It was a Sunday ritual she shared with her dad, listening, talking and soaking in the stories behind each album and the artwork on every sleeve. Though her dad is no longer with us, she continues this tradition with her friend, Sam Timmerman. Join them as they share their passion for vinyl and the stories these records hold. 
 
00:44 - Alexis (Host)
Hello brother. 
 
00:46 - Sam (Host)
Hello, hello. Look at you. It's good to see your face again. Other end of the country once more
 
00:49 - Alexis (Host)
And for the people listening, hearing your voice. 
 
00:57 - Sam (Host)
Exactly. 
 
00:58 - Alexis (Host)
All right, what do you got for me, brother? Wait, let me start the timer Ten minutes. Ten minutes All right, what have you got? 
 
01:04 - Sam (Host)
I have Sunshower by Couch. 
 
01:08 - Alexis (Host)
That is a perfect album title for something really gorgeous the abstract-y artwork on the front is really pretty. 
 
01:17 - Sam (Host)
Having not even thought of this until this exact moment. Sunshower is actually one of my favourite experiences just being in a sunshower. 
 
01:28 - Alexis (Host)
Oh really. 
 
01:28 - Sam (Host)
And it could sound super artsy and weird, but you know that's just me. And yeah, sunshowers are beautiful and I just thought that then. 
 
01:39 - Alexis (Host)
Now that you say that, that's actually probably pretty valid, because one I do like sunshine and I like the sound of rain. 
 
01:50 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, it's beautiful. This is going deeper than I thought we were going to go, so Do sun showers happen as much over there as over in the west, as we might say? 
 
02:05 - Alexis (Host)
I mean, I don't know percentages, but they happen sometimes. 
 
02:10 - Sam (Host)
That was my attempt at a segue to my hot take, hot pick of the album which is. Which was horrible, but we take it Again wasn't pre-planned. 
 
02:26 - Alexis (Host)
I apologise, but a hot pick for me is LA. Okay, talk me through this. 
 
02:33 - Sam (Host)
Partly because I mean what a sound We'll talk about the album sound in a minute, but what a sound that track has. It is massive. 
 
02:42 - Alexis (Host)
Absolutely huge. So for our listeners, I think we need to paint a little bit of a picture. 
 
02:47 - Sam (Host)
Yes. 
 
02:48 - Alexis (Host)
These guys are a seven-piece funk-pomp band out of the States. 
 
02:54 - Sam (Host)
Boston, massachusetts, boston, boston, how do you say it? Boston? I don't know. I don't know I think we should stop here. 
 
03:01 - Alexis (Host)
Don't come up, please don't cancel us. I don't know, I think we should stop. Don't come after us, please don't cancel us. But this particular record, like the best way to describe I think the sound, would be that it's like full, bright poppy lyrics, a lot of jazzy chords, because all of the players are like from lots of different influences and genres, um, really groovy and like funky drums. And obviously you know, for anyone who's in the know, drums and bass have, you know this marriage of solidness, so you know that funky groove is is with the bass as well. Um, and then they've also got some horns players in there? 
 
03:52 - Sam (Host)
Any fans of bands like Late Street Dive, lawrence, wolfpack? These are the. This is what we're talking about here. I came across these guys on a I think it was on a song radio from Lawrence and just blew me away. They've just returned from a. I think it was something like 30-something city tour with Corey Wong supporting Corey Wong, which is astronomical undertaking in itself, but 38 sounds right. Yeah, supporting the one and only Corey Wong sounds right. Yeah, supporting the one and only Corey Wong. And that is the sound that they create and they knock it out of the park and it is so much fun. 
 
04:34 - Alexis (Host)
Well, I didn't know who these guys were until I was with you, and either we were in the car or we were listening to something at your house. But I remember hearing it and being like oof, damn, what's this? 
 
04:50 - Sam (Host)
Oh, you said it was Jessie the track, Jessie, wasn't it? 
 
04:52 - Alexis (Host)
Yes, which is my hot pick. 
 
04:55 - Sam (Host)
There you go. 
 
04:56 - Alexis (Host)
It was just so funky and even before I got into the lyrics, just the melody lines and the hook, everything just got me straight away and I remember you being like oh yeah, I'll just send it to you. And I was like who are these guys? 
 
05:09 - Sam (Host)
What a bass line right what a bass line in that album. 
 
05:16 - Alexis (Host)
but then when I had a chance to dive in, not just listening, I mean I'm such a lyric person I froth at. I mean, look, a lot of lyrics are written about story, about relationship breakdowns. But I really enjoy when it's not a romantic relationship breakdown, when it's something else. And this song is about a friendship, about you know why are you not answering Like? You know, I've listened to your voicemail more than I've heard your own voice like and it's so relatable for anyone who's had a friendship breakdown as an adult. You know they're pretty painful, they're actually so much worse than romantic ones sometimes. 
 
06:03
But yeah, I just it was. Yeah, I was like yeah, damn great song. 
 
06:07 - Sam (Host)
For anyone who listens to the live in LA version of the record, they excuse me. They recorded the whole thing on tour in LA before they released. Beside of this record in particular is the live in LA show, and they introduced that song with this is for anyone who's been ghosted by a close friend yeah yeah, right, 
 
06:34 - Alexis (Host)
I mean yeah, I want to see more artists write songs like that. Totally, I, I've done it. It's true. 
 
06:50 - Sam (Host) 
I'm sorry if you guys are near, by the way. Yeah, but another example of really great groovy fun tunes written about painful subjects. 
 
06:59 - Alexis (Host)
Oh yeah, you need the vessel to be able to get in to have conversation and, why not, the layer of groovy, funky music. 
 
07:09 - Sam (Host)
So then, for people like me who like listening to the music, they can just go yeah, this is great. What are they talking about? I've listened to this album enough times to know most of the lyrics in other languages also. 
 
07:24 - Alexis (Host)
Really. 
 
07:24 - Sam (Host)
No, I'm exaggerating, but I've listened to this album a lot. But yeah, thinking of hot picks, I was thinking about what I was into at the moment and LA just came up. Just a it's a real feeling of being the other side of the country is okay. 
 
07:45 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, that's kind of how I took it yeah in a very, very small nutshell do you have a runner-up, a favorite? 
 
07:55 - Sam (Host)
yeah, um, I think I wrote down Someone With You because it just is so much fun. Um, yeah, lyrically and musically, it's just so much fun.
 
08:02 - Alexis (Host)
Well, true to my stylings, I love the sort of emotional power ballady kinds of vibes I really like. My runner-up is a song called All Right, which is the last one on the record. And it starts out real moody and then it like comes into itself a bit more. 
 
08:34 - Sam (Host)
But it's just like the chorus is epic. 
 
08:36 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, such an epic chorus. It's so glorious. Listeners, get onto this record. 
 
08:42 - Sam (Host)
Listen to it, because we're not going to play it for you. 
 
08:44 - Alexis (Host)
Go and listen to this record. 
 
08:46 - Sam (Host)
Buy this record, if you buy it. 
 
08:49 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, they're on. Bandcamp too, they're on. 
 
08:50 - Sam (Host)
Bandcamp If you buy it from oh, they're on Bandcamp too. They're on Bandcamp If you buy it from them. They will ship it to you, and I'm pretty sure they're still signing it. 
 
08:56 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my goodness. So for those listening, sam's shoved into the camera part of the sleeve of the vinyl, which is a glorious picture of them holding umbrellas, which is one of their schticks that they do on stage and that is like part of their props, um, and they've signed it, which is beautiful find it hand signed, limited edition. 
 
09:20
And no joke, they sent this to me the day before they left on tour with Cory these guys are amazing didn't you say that, like the band members, one of them actually is like their manager, oh so they're all self-producing, self-managing. 
 
09:35 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, Zach, the guitarist is the band's manager. This record was majority produced by the band members. 
 
09:41 - Alexis (Host)
Except for one song which is All Right, yeah yeah. Speaking of, I was talking about the umbrellas and their stage and their shtick. 
 
09:51 - Sam (Host)
Oh, the couch. 
 
09:52 - Alexis (Host)
Can I just say, yeah, we, Sam and I had dived into this and found out about the fact that, yeah, they sort of have a different couch. That sort of is part of the aesthetic depending on the release, it's a different colour or a different, yeah, different, kind of couch which they absolutely love because they use it as a prop and have it on stage. But what did we read? Like an interview they did, and they were like, oh, it's so great, we love it. 
 
10:21 - Sam (Host)
They went away from the room and then came back and there was a cushion with Jeff Goldblum's face on it. 
 
10:26 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my God true. Yes they did a show in Massachusetts and they'd just like gone oh my God, true, yes, I did a show in Massachusetts and they'd just like gone off to talk to people after the show and went back on stage to like load out and they found this really sparkly. I mean, what do they call those pillows? They're the pillows that have, like, the sequins on them. So when you push all the sequins one direction, oh yeah. 
 
10:50
And then when you push the sequins another way, it shows this picture face yeah of Geoff. 
 
10:58 - Sam (Host)
Of Geoff Geoff Ten minutes already. Ok, Sunshower by couch. 
 
11:06 - Alexis (Host)
You won't be disappointed. It is an earworm. Thanks, brother, that was a great one Signing off. 
 
11:11
That was fun all right signing off. Thanks for tuning in for another episode of through the creative door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom/throughthecreativedoor or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favourite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

6 | There’s Always Another Shell When You Need It with Gerard Russo

In this episode of Through the Creative Door, Alexis sits down with Gerard, a talented creative known for his unique approach to art. Gerard’s signature style combines mark-making, painting, etching, and strategic backlighting to challenge the traditional boundaries between sculpture and painting. He shares insights into his creative process, how he navigates the hustle of being a working artist, and the rewards of commissioned projects. Tune in for a deep dive into the intersection of art, innovation, and perseverance, and get inspired by his journey as an artist pushing the limits of traditional mediums.
If you’d like to see more, you can follow Gerard on instagram; @ gerard.russo.art
 
This episode was recorded on 15 February 2025 on the lands of the Woiworung Peoples. We hope that this episode inspires you as a creative person and as a human being.
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for creative people to share their story and inspire others. Have you got someone in mind who would love to have a chat? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
…
Creative resources from Gerard:
Obstacle Is The Way by Ryan Holiday 
Mastery by Robert Greene
101 Things to Learn At Art School by Kit White 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikToc: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
00:09 - Alexis (Host)
Hello, my name is Alexis Naylor and I am your host here at Through the Creative Door. On behalf of myself and my guests, I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. Owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. May we pay our respects to all First Nations people and acknowledge Elders, past and present. On this podcast, I'll be chatting to an array of creative guests, getting a glimpse into their worlds and having some honest and inspiring conversations along the way. I'm delighted to welcome you to Through the Creative Door. 
Hello, you, amazing human being. Oh, my goodness, I am so chuffed to be having you on Through the Creative Door. 
 
01:01 - Gerard (Guest)
Thank you for having me, yeah, and for calling me an amazing human being. You're also. You're also an amazing human being. 
 
01:07 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my goodness you are such a talented bear for those listening. I am in this beautiful space of yours looking at some of your stunning artwork that is um surrounding me. How would I describe your signature medium? there's so many, 
 
01:26 - Gerard (Guest)
Often the reaction I get. People will be like so what am I? What is that? What am I looking at? 
 
01:34 - Alexis (Host)
it's so beautiful. 
 
01:35 - Gerard (Guest)
I love working in a medium that does that to people. It just confuses people right away. It's a great, great tactic right Start off with confusion. 
 
01:45 - Alexis (Host)
Fantastic. Fantastic.
 
01:47 - Gerard (Guest)
I'd describe it as an interplay of emitted light and reflective light that I'm very attracted to. But yeah, so my process is a mark-making process combined with an etching process and a backlighting process. 
 
02:06 - Alexis (Host)
So yeah, it is a bit confusing. It's not confusing, it's just beautiful tapestry of creative ventures all in the one to create your work. It's, yeah, absolutely stunning. 
 
02:21 - Gerard (Guest)
Thank you. Thank you. I guess that's why I keep doing this, because that end result that I get it's It can be so varied and so wonderful. I really really love working in it, which is why I've worked in it for a while now. 
 
02:31 - Alexis (Host)
Well, I mean, gerard, you have like such a yeah, distinct signature? 
 
02:42 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, thank you. It's a nice medium because I can really open it up in the way I backlight it. I can express anything I want on top of it which will be backlit. But also there's the copper and how it can change, and how it can change in getting a different patina, effect or reflectivity. Yeah, it's just got lots of potential I can keep unpacking and keep challenging myself with, I suppose. Yeah. 
 
03:16 - Alexis (Host)
And that's half the fun of it, right. 
 
03:18 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, it's fun a lot of the time, but I'm sure, yeah, as you know, with processes come headaches. 
 
03:24 - Alexis (Host)
Trials and tribulations. 
 
03:25 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, yeah but I think, I think every or a lot of artists they, they need that to an extent, they need a challenge and it's definitely been that in many ways yeah, how beautiful. 
 
03:42 - Alexis (Host)
We are in your beautiful home. we are next to your gorgeous office. I have a sense that this is one of your many creative spaces. Yes, but I'm not going to lead you down the garden path. 
 
03:58 - Gerard (Guest)
No, that's okay, yeah, yeah. 
 
04:00 - Alexis (Host)
What does a creative space mean to you and why? 
 
04:04 - Gerard (Guest)
I think yeah is a dedicated space that is free from judgment from yourself and other people and one way you feel safe to create. Essentially and I'm lucky to have that as a dedicated art studio with my partner, elizabeth um- 
 
04:25 - Alexis (Host) 
Who for those listening we have had on the podcast she's the one that got me into she, she roped you in yeah, she
 
04:41 - Gerard (Guest) 
I'm very glad. Um, so we have a joint studio and, yeah, it's lovely and I'm lucky to have had a dedicated studio space for over 10 years, you know, in various houses. Yeah, I think it's really important just to have a nice lead space, if you can. I know so many people. It would be the kitchen table for a temporary time, but for that temporary time it's still a dedicated space and creating that is important. Um, so, yeah
 
05:14 - Alexis (Host)
Love it. Well, it's stunning, stunning. Can I just teleport here anytime that I want to? 
 
05:21 - Gerard (Guest)
I should also say, yeah, I'm sitting at my desk, which is what I use for the administrative part of my art practice, and I feel like that's really important, too, to have it separate from the creative space because, that's a pretty hard thing to separate sometimes, and I do have a workshop where I do a lot of my building and etching and things like that. 
 
05:44 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, beautiful. Now. You've been in this artist game for a long time, but could you um share with us a body of work or a piece of work or a project that you're most proud of creating, and how did it come about? 
 
06:13 - Gerard (Guest)
I don't have a specific body of work or even a single work that I'm most proud that I can think of, but, um, what I am really proud of is having it is being an artist that some people have come to and been commissioned for some extremely sentimental artworks, and just to be an artist that people think of for such a dedicated, sentimental gift or gift to themselves In particular. There was a few over the last two years, but there's one in particular that I actually I can't really talk about in honor of the client. But, yeah, that's probably what I'm most proud of is to be there. 
 
07:03 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, that's probably what I'm most proud of is to be there and in those instances, like, are people sourcing you out? And reaching out to you or have they, like, come across you for a word of mouth and seen? 
 
07:14 - Gerard (Guest)
your work. Yeah, it's often a combination, Like they might see me at Open Studios, which is actually coming up in March. Which is actually coming up in March. But yeah, that one in particular was word of mouth from another artist that actually recommended me to these people. 
 
07:32
So yeah you don't necessarily know where it's going to come from. You've just got to keep creating and putting yourself out there. I guess I think it's a good sign you're doing pretty good if stuff is coming to you, um, but it doesn't always happen like that, so you can't just expect that. You gotta, you gotta also push, push for it. Yeah, the hustle, the hustle. Yeah. Well, I think I think a big part of the hustle is just like being active in what you do, you know, yeah and being active in community too, letting people know what you're up to, what you're doing. 
 
08:05
And that was what really got my practice off the ground was starting to do open studios in the Darling Ranges here and, yeah, it made me commit to my practice more. It connected me with the community and other artists in that community. So it's just like, yeah, you just got to surround yourself with it, right, you just got to stand on a box. Even so, it's just like, yeah, just, you just got to surround yourself with it, right, you just got to put stand on a box. Even if it's uncomfortable, we've got to, you know. 
 
08:28 - Alexis (Host)
I'm here yeah, I'm here, hi, everyone look at this stuff I made. Look at this cool thing I did
 
08:32 - Gerard (Guest)
yeah yeah, it can be a weird, weird thing, but um, it's a really beautiful thing sometimes, yeah. 
 
08:43 - Alexis (Host)
On the flip side of things that you're proud of. Have you had something challenge your creativity?
 
08:53 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, my entire medium. What do you mean? Well, you know this isn't my primary medium for those listening. My primary medium for those listening is copper and acrylic sort of backing, so it's not a readily available material. I do work in charcoal and paper as well and dabbling in a bit of sculpture, and my works are primarily sculpture, but it's 2D wall art. But this material I couldn't access it in big quantities, large quantities at all. I had to have it actually manufactured just to be able to do it. 
 
09:37 - Alexis (Host)
Right yeah. 
 
09:38 - Gerard (Guest)
So yeah, I don't know if you imagine just not being able to go to the shops and buy a canvas kind of thing, that's like. Just to start with, that was a big challenge negotiating to get things manufactured and imported, and it was a real commitment to my art. It was a real decision my, my art. It's a real decision.
 
10:06 - Alexis (Host)
And how have you sort of like maneuvered through that with like negotiating and like.
 
10:08 - Gerard (Guest)
Uh well, I just had to keep, keep working it and keep talking to suppliers building those relationships and yeah, yeah, it was a little while back now and because I had to order a big quantity. So, yeah, yeah, it's a really fun medium to work in, but I'd say that was a big challenge and.
 
10:23 - Alexis (Host)
Did it make you think, perhaps, maybe that was there ever a crossroads for you of whether that was the medium that you wanted to continue working?
 
10:41 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, like a lot of artists, I had doubled around in a lot of different mediums. I've always drawn and that's always been a foundation for me, but I was doing animation and, yeah, filmmaking for a bit and jewelry making, which is kind of how I got into etching copper in the first place, as well as making electronics and all kinds of I'm a maker as well, you know so master of all the trades yeah, um, but yeah, like I said, it was definitely uh a decision to commit, but I think, uh, yeah, I saw the potential in the material and I wanted to work with it. 
 
11:20 - Alexis (Host)
And there's so much beauty in it. Thanks, so much beauty in it. I'm glad that you persevered. Now, do you have an object or a thing that you can't live without when you're creating? 
 
11:40 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, and you probably get this answer a lot. My headphones. 
 
11:44 - Alexis (Host)
Really? Why? 
 
11:48 - Gerard (Guest)
Well, in the workshop they protect my ears from loud noises, but also if I'm in the studio and I just need the music or I need an audiobook or something, it can really help my mind just focus on something while my hands do a lot of the work. Yeah, I've also got this sterling silver mechanical pencil that I picked up on a road trip and I like to start a sketch with that if I can. And I like to start a sketch with that if I can. It's like a cool art deco, one made in the 1950s. 
 
12:26 - Alexis (Host)
That's so cool. 
 
12:26 - Gerard (Guest)
It's like a beautiful object, and I've got a watch that I bought when I sold my first house, yeah, which is sentimental. It reminds me that time is limited to keep going,
 
12:42 - Alexis (Host)
And we spoke off mic about your watch being one of those self-winding. 
 
12:50 - Gerard (Guest)
It's a self-winding mechanism. It's so special I actually have to keep moving if I want to know what time it is. 
 
12:57 - Alexis (Host)
It's like what are you doing? 
 
12:58 - Gerard (Guest)
moving your hand around Trying to make my watch give you. Why are you still waving at me? Why are you doing moving your hand around trying to make my watch.  
 
13:05 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, I do like beautiful objects like that. Um, I wouldn't say I collected lots of stuff, but yeah, those would probably be the big ones. But yeah, headphones definitely like you can isolate yourself with them, you can like. Sometimes I actually just put them in to make the world a bit quieter so I can focus and, yeah, very versatile good anchor yeah, the earbuds yeah yeah.
 
13:33 - Alexis (Host)
Amazing. Now, if you could give one piece of advice, one nugget of gold to another creative, what would it be? 
 
13:43 - Gerard (Guest)
We're talking about this off mic before a bit as well that's just so many rabbit holes um, I would really recommend approaching art from a place that's always coming from you and not be making art for someone else. I think there's a definite distinction there and you're going to make the. If you make work from you, you're making the best art possible because it's from your hands, it's from your heart, so you just have to keep trying to connect with that place. I see a lot of artists trying to chase the client by making what they think people want, but I genuinely believe that there is a market for what you make, naturally, so that's probably a good snippet of wisdom. Another one would probably be um, it's hard right, because we're talking about this too. 
 
14:48
We're talking about this the art thing, the hustle thing is really hard and, uh, one side effect of working from yourself is that it can really it can break you sometimes. It can really be a lot of hard work. You might end up questioning what it is that you're doing like, because it's very hard to be a creative in society, right, um, but all those broken feelings when you're at that point and it's just, it feels a bit like life or death, it feels fractured, it feels really broken, like it's just a shell. You just have to actually push through that, because there's a flood of creativity behind that and that's where the growth is in your practice as well. And there's always another shell for you when you need it. 
 
15:44 - Alexis (Host)
So true. 
 
15:47 - Gerard (Guest)
There's as many as you need. 
 
15:50 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, such wise words. Such wise words, my goodness. Now, if someone wanted to develop their creative process, if someone wanted to do what you do and I know that's multifaceted because you, you know, etch and draw and sculpt and whatever but are there any resources or guides or podcast courses, anything?
 
16:24 - Gerard (Guest)
Your postcast, oh, everybody should listen to this you're too kind I actually. 
 
16:31
I actually don't do that many podcasts. I do a lot of audiobooks. Um, yeah, I I do have some resources that I've been recently on that uh, neon that are quite good. Ryan Holiday's the Obstacle is the Way. I'm really loving it's taking examples from history and how facing the fight of the thing is actually the way through the thing. What was the other one? Yeah, Mastery by Robert Greene is a really, really good book. It does a similar thing. I haven't finished it, but I'm really loving it. Good insight into human behavior and even talks about the idea of apprenticeships and things like that and working under mentors and things like that. 
 
17:32 - Alexis (Host)
Have you ever had a mentor? 
 
17:34 - Gerard (Guest)
No, I had lecturers I looked up to a lot, but I like the idea of a mentor. I mean, I would have loved to have one for my practice, but it just wasn't there because there's no one really doing what I do. So not exactly, but uh, yeah, my work's a lot like um printmaking in many ways. You know, etching copper for that. Um, yeah, like direct examples of people that want to do what I do, I would say look at printmaking, or look at backlighting or lighting designers and things like that. 
 
18:07 - Alexis (Host)
Amazing. 
 
18:08 - Gerard (Guest)
But yeah, I got a book behind me, actually that I this book. By who is it? Kit White 101 Things to Learn at Art School. 
 
18:21 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my goodness. 
 
18:23 - Gerard (Guest)
It's so good. It's just got nice little snippets. 
 
18:26 - Alexis (Host)
Oh wonderful, yeah, I'm going to have a look at that off camera, off mic. Yeah, it's very good. 
 
18:31 - Gerard (Guest)
I think it's more visual art focused, but it's really good. 
 
18:35 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, I love that. 
 
18:37 - Gerard (Guest)
I like the title as well. 
 
18:38 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, such a great title yeah. 
 
18:43 - Gerard (Guest)
It's very, very cheeky. I love it. 
 
18:48 - Alexis (Host)
Last question if you could have anyone come on this podcast and answer these questions, who would it be and why? 
 
18:56 - Gerard (Guest)
Can I? Can I offer two yes, please so, uh, the first one is my brother. He is a Luthier, he makes acoustic guitars and he's probably the most talented crafts person I know, so I feel like that would be a good one today. It's music and craft, so it might be a good fit. And the other is my friend, Sarah Caso. She's a jazz musician and very, very talented and such a lovely person. Oh, vibe, yeah, yeah, yeah, you'll love her. But yeah, those are two creatives in my life that have really helped me out. 
 
19:39 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah. 
 
19:40 - Gerard (Guest)
Yeah. 
 
19:41 - Alexis (Host)
Beautiful, oh my goodness. Thank you so much for being through the creative door and having us have this beautiful chat. Yeah, such a joy. 
 
19:53
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom/throughthecreativedoor or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favourite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

BSIDE Water

Featured Artist: Kerryn Fields
Featured Vinyl: Water
 
Alexis’ Hot Pick 
Escape
Sam’s Hot Pick
Mamma
Aus Music Alert! Support this artists by purchasing this record via Bandcamp:
https://kerrynfields.bandcamp.com/album/water  
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for an artist's vinyl to listen to, have you got one in mind that we should check out? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Co-Host: Sam Timmerman
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Voiceover: Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
00:09 - Intro (Announcement)
Welcome to B-Side, the mini-series from Through the Creative Door. Join Alexis and Sam as they dive into the timeless world of vinyl. For Alexis, vinyl was more than music. It was a Sunday ritual she shared with her dad, listening, talking and soaking in the stories behind each album and the artwork on every sleeve. Though her dad is no longer with us, she continues this tradition with her friend, Sam Timmerman. Join them as they share their passion for vinyl and the stories these records hold. 
 
00:44 - Alexis (Host)
Hello brother. 
 
00:46 - Sam (Host)
Good afternoon. Is it afternoon over there? I think it is. 
 
00:52 - Alexis (Host)
Evening. We have a time difference between the west and the east coast. 
 
00:57 - Sam (Host)
I was about to do signs, and that's a really bad thing to do. West Coast. 
 
01:04 - Alexis (Host)
West Coast. Yeah, all right, what do we got? Got another week, another. Oh, it's my turn. 
 
01:14 - Alexis (Host)
Episode five, and I am sharing 10-minute timer 10-minute timer. Boom, all right. 
 
01:23 - Sam (Host)
You're sharing. What have we got? 
 
01:25 - Alexis (Host)
We got an album called Water. You know I like my elements.
 
01:30 - Sam (Host)
True, Kerryn Fields. This artwork is gorgeous, by the way. 
 
01:36 - Alexis (Host)
Yes, so we've got another Australian artist that we get to represent, get to talk about. It's so beautiful, so this album. She had a marriage breakdown and she went down the Great Ocean Road in Victoria and wrote this phenomenal album. The artwork is based off the beach and the ocean down that way and there's an artist who did the artwork and somewhere, I think on karen's socials you can see, like all of the behind the scenes photos and the art artist putting together that. 
 
02:25 - Sam (Host)
Those of you in that region or in Australia, or even if you're not, if you have not been to the Great Ocean Road change that. 
 
02:33 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, but the artist who painted the artwork? I believe her name is Louise Mitchell, but alongside with Karen Fields they designed the the record. 
 
02:46 - Sam (Host)
Did they design it off a photo. I think, or were they there? 
 
02:50 - Alexis (Host)
No, I think Louise based it off a photo, but I think she went to the beach and they like figured it out, yeah, and she painted, and then Kerryn put together this beautiful piece. 
 
03:07 - Sam (Host)
It's fantastic. They're pretty, very pretty pretty, and recorded in Colingwood I believe. 
 
03:11 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, yeah, because I think some of it was recorded in the actual house down the great ocean road wow yeah, so I believe that there was a house called the Water House, which is, I mean, makes sense when the album's called Water. And then, yes, I think Avery Studios in Collingwood was where the rest of it got recorded. 
 
03:36 - Sam (Host)
That's fantastic. Yeah, did they do the entire album as a single room single mic, or did they split, because I know some of the tracks were done single mic? 
 
03:45 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, so my understanding is that Karen performed, yeah, live, and they taped it. So, yeah, so it was vocals, guitar, drums, upright bass in one room, from memory, and then I think there might have been some features that were done later. 
 
04:12 - Sam (Host)
There are a few other records that have been done that style and they're some of my favourites. Shout out to the Seals, okay, yeah, vibe, they're some of my favourites. 
 
04:34 - Alexis (Host)
Shout out to the seals see, okay, yeah, bud um, charlie phil tom, love you all represent they're not playing together anymore, but that's okay. 
 
04:37 - Sam (Host)
I mean projects, so you might have to listen to that one sometime. 
 
04:39 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, this beautiful record I really liked inside. The artwork inside is really pretty and it has, like all of the little thank yous and all that kind of hoo-ha Love it. But one thing that I love the most is this little bit this album was independently crowdfunded with the support from 173 friends. 
 
05:07 - Sam (Host)
Oh, that's gorgeous. 
 
05:09 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, isn't that pretty, I love and thank you all. 
 
05:13 - Sam (Host)
Amazing. 
 
05:14 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, beautiful, huh, beautiful, all right. Well, on that note, what was your hot pick, Sam? 
 
05:22 - Sam (Host)
Mama, I got closely behind by On the Porch. Okay, I'm going to talk about On the Porch first, because that was just fun. It might have been. In whatever state of mind I was in first time listening through this record, it wasn't clicking for me for the first few tracks. And on the porch happened and I went oh, I'm home, here we go. That was fantastic. It's um such a fun little romping tune. I really liked that. But, mama, um more so. Let's keep saying it, more so lyrically than orally, musically. I was just listening to that going Mama's love's going to set you right. 
 
06:11
It doesn't matter what else, there's nothing else that's going to fix you. I think second verse they talk about their authorities are going to chase you and they're going to get you, but mum's love's going to fix you. And yeah, it just just has sat a little bit, sat really nicely. 
 
06:33 - Alexis (Host)
And I think it's that thing about exactly what you were saying, depending on what mood you come to music with the reasons for why an artist or someone, the vision of how and why they created it, it's almost null and void.
 
07:01 - Sam (Host)
I'm sorry, it just started cutting out again. Okay, I feel like it's only doing it when we're recording, which is weird because it's a connection issue. I'm very confused. 
Yeah, I think we are open to music how it comes to us. So, however, we're, you know, open to receive it at that time. I think this album obviously for myself and my own personal experiences. I really resonate with the fact that it's surrounding. You know the breakdown of a relationship. But, it doesn't need to mean that at all. 
 
08:09 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, it seems like a lot of powerful songs written about the breakdowns of relationships aren't necessarily written at the time of those breakdowns. Like a lot of amazing songs that have been written that are powerful like that. You read into it and you go. Well, this person didn't have any of that experience. 
 
It doesn't make the song any less powerful, but the identity of the song changes for the listener a little bit, whereas, like you're saying, you have a shared experience that allows you to come to that tune from that space 
 
9:00 - Alexis (Host) 
And I also think that part of losing a relationship, I mean there's grief that's connected in that and, and especially for you know this artist, she's originally from new zealand, so when you have something dissolved like that, it's also the homesickness and and community and everything around that, but like tapping into something else and creating something really beautiful from a not so great place yeah, absolutely. 
 
09:19 - Sam (Host)
There's a friend of mine who's I haven't had that experience per se myself. A friend of mine has had a very similar experience, though. Um, so I'm not going to name drop because that's not appropriate, but I might send them the album yeah, it's beautiful, really beautiful, really hits, hits a chord for me. 
 
09:38 - Alexis (Host)
The song that's my hot pick is um escape, um, and I think for everything that I've just sort of spoken about, it really sort of hits a chord with me, um, in a way that I probably can't really articulate, um, but I would say it's because it hits pretty close to home. So, yeah, yeah, but it's beautiful and it's. It's that heartbreaking, heart-wrenching, glorious beauty that comes in, you know, to art, where it's not shiny and beautiful, it's messy and all sorts and beautiful yeah, 
10:01 - Sam (Host) 
You can't grab it what onto something that doesn't have spikes or bumps, or if it's smooth and shiny, you can't latch on. 
 
10:24 - Alexis (Host)
Exactly, exactly and really anything to do with water. I'm such a beach baby and water baby so, like, everything about this album is just yeah. 
 
10:35 - Sam (Host)
I heard there's some sort of track about water in one of your new records coming up. 
 
10:39 - Intro (Announcement)
Oh yes. Well, yes, there's a bit of elements in my coming up. Oh yes, wow. 
 
10:42 - Alexis (Host)
Yes, there's a bit of elements in my new record. 
 
10:45 - Sam (Host)
There is a little bit in there that I've heard about, yeah, which will come up eventually, I'm sure. 
 
10:51 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we'll come back to that another day. 
 
10:54 - Sam (Host)
For those listening and watching, the little bits that I've heard have been spectacular. 
 
10:58 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, stop, stop, stop. That's not what this is for. 
 
11:01 - Sam (Host)
It's not. No, it's not, but we're allowed to. 
 
11:04 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, true, true. But for those listening, oh, my goodness, again we've got another Australian artist. Please support local music. Please have a look at them on Bandcamp. Support, buy, donate, do all of the wonderful things to help out, Go to shows. 
 
11:23 - Sam (Host)
Go to shows. If they're playing live, go and see them. Say hi to them. Yeah, yeah it makes a huge difference to someone. Someone buying a record is amazing. Someone giving up their time to see you perform a record is next level. 
 
11:37 - Alexis (Host)
And if you have no money, oh, there's our timer 10 minutes. Um, yes, for those listening, karen fields album name is water. You will not be disappointed. Jump on to band camp, support her, support this album. It's glorious. 
 
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom/throughthecreativedoor or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favorite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

5 | Your Junk, My Art with David Cox

This episode features an engaging conversation with David Cox, an assemblage sculptor who repurposes piano keys and other materials into unique sculptures. He discusses the importance of having a dedicated creative space, the challenges of identifying himself as an artist, and the pride he feels in his work, particularly his “piano phoenix” sculpture, which helps people preserve sentimental items. David also shares insights into his creative process, his reliance on community support, and the value of organisation as an artist. The episode explores themes of transformation, creative evolution, and the power of community in the creative process.
 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikToc: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
00:09 - Alexis (Host)
Hello, my name is Alexis Naylor and I am your host here at Through the Creative Door. On behalf of myself and my guests, I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. Owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. May we pay our respects to all First Nations people and acknowledge Elders, past and present. On this podcast, I'll be chatting to an array of creative guests, getting a glimpse into their worlds and having some honest and inspiring conversations along the way. I'm delighted to welcome you to Through the Creative Door. 
Oh, my goodness, David Cox. Welcome to Through the Creative Door. 
 
00:56 - David (Guest)
Thank you for having me. I deny everything that has been said about me before, except the good stuff. 
 
01:04 - Alexis (Host)
All the good stuff, you come highly recommended oh gosh, that's worrying no, it's not somebody talking about. You are such a talented bear, my goodness um for those listening. We are sitting in your studio, it is absolutely glorious, with all these beautiful piano keys and trinkets and wood and, oh my goodness, so many things. 
 
01:34 - David (Guest) 
 You're sitting next to half a bag of concrete at the moment it's a variety
 
01:45 - Alexis (Host) 
It's a spice of life. 
 
01:48 - David (Guest)
Yeah, in here primarily piano keys. I think there's about 23 different pianos worth of piano keys in here at the moment, which seems to be my usual medium as an assemblage sculptor. 
 
02:00 - Alexis (Host)
I'm going to launch into the first question. 
 
02:02 - David (Guest)
Oh yeah, questions, Questions, shoot. 
 
02:08 - Alexis (Host)
What does a creative space mean to you? 
 
02:13 - David (Guest)
Well, you're sitting in it at the moment and it is assumed as much. A bit of a mess. I think there's two answers to that. For me, there's an element of practicality, so I'm currently surrounded by tools and sawdust and mess. So having a dedicated space to work on, particularly because I'm building large-ish sculptures like the size of a door, I can't do that on my kitchen bench, I can't do that on the coffee table or the bedroom floor or whatever. I think I'd be single very fast. 
02:52 - Alexis (Host) 
You don't think your wife would approve?
 
02:57 - David (Guest)
There's some patience there, but understandably that can only go so far. So, yeah, having a dedicated is is vital for my work. That's obviously going to vary for, uh, for perhaps for a watercolor painter, for example, you might be able to sit in that that sunny corner of the of the house and and paint, and that that would actually look really smart. But, uh, but I can't do that in the house. So there's definitely that practical element Noise as well. Actually I can't do that in the house. 
 
03:30
So the other half really is I don't like the phrase man cave. I think I started coining a phrase of like man cave, she shared they space. A phrase of like man cave, she shared they space. But anyway, I I think having a, a space for me to come to and change gears, like I used to commute in and out of the city every day. But now I walk out of my house and I turn left. My wife turns right, she goes and works from the tiny house in the driveway. I turn left and I walk into my studio and it's a gear changer, a chapter changer, a palate cleanser or whatever you see it as. So for me, I change clothes, I put on my my work gear and I come to work, even though I realize I piss fart around in a shed. So yeah, the practical side of not messing up my house or my relationship, uh and and having, uh, having that palate cleanser, I suppose.  
 
04:41 - Alexis (Host)
Beautiful, well said said. Now, as a creative being I mean you've mentioned you know how your sculptures have come to fruition, so this question could be about sculptures. But actually, as a creative being, you have lots of ventures, so could be anything what is something that you're most proud of creating and how did it come about? 
 
05:04 - David (Guest)
I know you were leading there with. I've certainly played music in the past and recorded music and toured and that's all been fun, but that's always been collaborative, whereas I think for the sculpture I was referring to earlier, which I I now, I now know as a phoenix, which I think is apt for a piano coming back to life or or whatever you want to call it, uh, I, I, I feel quite proud of that, I think because of that moment that I mentioned earlier, where I could have just done this the way that I'd planned on it, but instead there was that something happened, something mystical and wonderful. 
 
05:57 - Alexis (Host)
The stars aligned. 
 
06:07 - David (Guest)
I feel, because it's a, when I go and hang it on a customer's wall and they bawl their eyes out usually because they're happy not from what I've done to their grandmother's piano there's a real feeling of I've done something important here, I've been able to help them avoid having to take that to the tip and but we can keep it and it's important to us, but we can't have it anymore. So in terms of pride, yeah, I feel that that design has been able to help me de-stress some people in some way. So, yes, I'd say my piano phoenix design. 
 
06:55 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, how wonderful, what a privilege to be able to give that gift. 
 
07:01 - David (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, seems strange, but I'm happy with that one Love it. 
 
07:07 - Alexis (Host)
On the flip side of things that you're proud of, is there something that's challenged your creativity over the years and, if so, how do you think you've mitigated that? 
 
07:25 - David (Guest)
I don't think I've ever considered myself an artist. 
 
07:29 - Alexis (Host)
What. 
 
07:29 - David (Guest)
I know that. So so I've. This is all quite new to me. It's been the last couple of years. Uh, you probably speak to a lot of people who have had a change in life during, during COVID um, me commuting in and out of the city and then all of a sudden, I'm stranded in the Dandenong Ranges, poor me, surrounded by rusty gold. It gave me that opportunity to try something new, but I'd never considered myself an artist. I guess I've always seen an artist as someone who sits down at an easel and paints, or now I fall into the category of an assemblage sculptor. But what is a sculptor? I see a sculptor as someone who's dedicated their life learning how to carve marble or throw pottery or do sculpting stuff. Me, I take old junk and glue it together in a shape that is enjoyable. 
 
08:38
So I think I've always struggled with that idea of being an artist and doing it full-time, I might add as well. That's that. That's a strange, a strange situation to find myself in, having come from your normal nine-to-five office job to now, yeah, being an artist. It just it's. It seems weird. So I think I've struggled with that and in terms of mitigating it, I so I've. I think I've struggled with that and in terms of mitigating it, uh, I think I've. In recent years, I've tried to surround myself with, um, supportive, constructive, uh creatives as well. Um, yeah, yeah, I think having having the right people around you can change your mindset significantly. So I still struggle with that, but it's a long and winding road. 
 
09:33 - Alexis (Host)
I think the beautiful thing about creative souls is being able to have an idea out of nothing and then being able to facilitate it. So, however you, whatever medium, however you can do that, there's a gift in that that is a true artist of having an idea from nothing and following it through. 
 
09:59 - David (Guest)
Yeah, yeah. And now for me, I get asked semi-regularly so what's next? What are you going to do? I think I've done 60 of these now, so for 60 customers in a few different countries as well, but that's been my bread and butter, I guess, over the last couple of years. So what's next couple of years? So what's next? So, uh, I'm currently working on trying to bring them, bring my sculptures, down off the wall and and turn them into a, into a 3d sculpture rather than 2d. So, uh, so yeah, there's some, some works in progress going on there. 
 
10:38
it's all a bit uh, all a bit new, but it's nice to step into to a new space anyway, into a proper, instead of moving from, I guess, a decor sculpture to a middle of the room with water, fountain-y things and lights and lasers. 
 
11:05 - Alexis (Host)
I love it. Now it'll be interesting whether. I'm very curious to see where you go with this answer. But do you have an object or a thing that you can't live without when you're creating, and it could be like something sentimental or something super practical? 
 
11:30 - David (Guest)
Yeah, I don't think I've got an awesome answer for this. I don't have magical socks or superstitious underwear or the likes. I have surrounded myself, as I say, with my trinkets and rusty gold, which so a lot of people might, a lot of artists might, have a picture in their head and I really want to do this, and then they'll figure out how to do it For me. I've tried to surround myself with the elements that I usually include in my work, and then I'll try this and I'll try that, and I'll throw a bunch of different things at a piece until something fits the way that I want it to. So I've certainly surrounded myself with that magic, but that's not my answer. Uh, I, I love my calendar, uh, so as in a physical calendar. 
 
12:32
so I, I, I don't need a um, I don't use an existing. I take a piece of paper and I, I draw it all up, um, and then I organize everything, uh, so that that I'm sure you probably speak to artists all the time and if you ever talk to them about deadlines, particularly for exhibitions or for client submissions or commissions or whatnot, the last minute rush is a big thing for people and I despise feeling that people and I despise feeling that. So for me, I like to be well ahead and well organized so that things happen well and I feel like I'm presenting myself in a more professional manner. So for me, I would have to say it's my calendar. I feel comfort looking at it and adjusting it. Uh, that's like a really weird thing to say fantastic. 
 
13:27 - Alexis (Host)
And so when you say that you draw, it is it like one big month at a time, or is it weekly, or is it like no, normally monthly, but at the moment we're coming into silly season for exhibitions, so over easter, uh, etc. 
 
13:43 - David (Guest)
Um, there there's a lot happening. I think I'm in four or five exhibitions over the Easter period, so everything needs, I need places. I've got places to be. I need to deliver then and pick up there and have that there, but I want it for another exhibition later on, so I can't have that there and this there. Anyway, it's a jumble of strings and lines and whatnot. 
 
14:04 - Alexis (Host)
I love it and and like, how big is this calendar? 
 
14:07 - David (Guest)
not very. I'll try and keep it a3 or smaller I'll see. 
 
14:11 - Alexis (Host)
I image in my mind is like the size of like a door. I was like I'm up here for it. I love it. 
 
14:16 - David (Guest)
If I join them all up over the year, then yeah, I guess it would be so. Yeah, but I'm being organized now. No, no lucky socks for me, but, um, being organized and however that needs to, needs to look I love it 
 
14:40 - Alexis (Host)
If you could give one piece of advice, one nugget of gold to another creative, what would it be? 
 
14:41 - David (Guest)
community is going to be going to be vital for anyone who's wanting to well, getting second opinions, getting connected through not even galleries, like exhibiting work, is nice, but I think at the initial stages it's really just having someone around you who's going to be supportive, who can share ideas I mean, friends nearby don't work in the same medium as me, but we're always able to bounce ideas off each other and, yeah, having constructive people around you. There's always going to be dickheads, but that's just our species. But I think if you can find the good souls, then yeah, keep them close. Community is vital. 
 
15:35 - Alexis (Host)
Well said, well said. Yeah, none of us find our way on our own. Yeah, it's totally with others. Yeah yeah, own, yeah, it's totally with others. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Extra question if someone wanted to develop their creative process and sort of do what you do, would you have any advice on any resources, um anything that you'd recommend they read or watch or listen to or do? 
 
16:06 - David (Guest)
So for me and this might vary depending on your medium, but maybe the location would vary For me I like to walk the aisles of my local hardware store We'll say the big green hardware store. Because I, yes, I've been renovating a house myself, with no skills but learning how to do things. 
 
16:35
I find my comfort space is walking the aisles, finding a new material that I didn't know about, and then learning how to utilize that material, whether it be glues, adhesives, fillers, paints, all sorts of bits and bobs. So in terms of a resource, maybe if you're a painter, you might find that it's your local art supply store or whatnot, but for me, as an assemblage sculptor, I need to figure out how to make things connect. So I guess the internet works in a similar sort of way. You can go digging around. I guess the internet works in a similar sort of way. You can go digging around, but for me, yeah, walking the aisles at my hardware store and learning about new materials. Learning about new, yeah, ways that are going to make my life easier, and learning the things I never knew were out there. 
 
17:48 - Alexis (Host)
So yeah, in the last six to twelve months has there been like a little like aha moment that you've had with like a problem or like an attachment, or
 
17:57 - David (Guest)
Yeah. So, uh, I, as I mentioned, I'm working on, uh, bringing my sculptures down off the wall. So everyone keeps telling me I need to go and learn how to do welding so that I can then build from, I guess, all the framework of that sculpture and then attach to it. I haven't got that far yet, but what I have been able to do was go okay, well, how can I build an internal structure for a sculpture that I'll then build around, and what can I build that out of? So I've found myself digging around through the, the plumbing section, and then, okay, well, I can screw that together and screw that together, and and then, all of a sudden, I have what I need to to then attach or be in the middle of to be able to attach things to. Yeah, yeah, yeah, plumbing. 
 
19:00 - Alexis (Host)
However, which way we come to it. 
 
19:02 - David (Guest)
Well, indeed right. So yes, I need to. You know, my next challenge is welding. I'll get onto that one next, but for now I've been solving my problems because I've got a warehouse of equipment that I can go and play with and buy what I need. 
 
19:21 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, don't you just love, I love that the journey as a creative is forever evolving. Yeah, like our world is all about labels and we have a particular label, but within that we're constantly pushing if we choose to step into that, to be constantly skilling up leveling up being pushed, I get bored. Well, that's what I'm yeah, me too, me too. It's it's like okay, how do I do this next project, but how do I push myself more than I did last time? Suckersuckers for punishment, I think. 
 
19:59 - David (Guest)
I think you're probably right. Yeah, there's certainly that feeling of success does help drive the next step into the unknown. So I think, yeah, with the new works that I'm working on, I think hopefully they're well received and if they are, then you go yay, success, or this is what success feels like. So what's next? 
 
20:28 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, it's always the what next. 
 
20:30 - David (Guest)
Yeah, it's probably slightly addictive, that moment, addictive, that, um, that, that moment. You you certainly find this with songwriting or or with any creative endeavor, or even then non-creative, but uh, that moment, that aha moment, or uh, that feeling. I've been struggling with this and trying to wrangle it into whatever shape that looks like it could be a project manager, it's probably the same feeling. And then the moment happens where, if that goes there and that goes there, I've got it. That feeling is fantastic. Big fan of that. What was the question? 
 
21:13 - Alexis (Host)
Well, we're talking about resources, but then we deviated from the question. 
 
21:19 - David (Guest)
It's so fun I've wandered way off track. 
 
21:22 - Alexis (Host)
I think it's my fault, it's fine. One last question. If you could have anyone come on this podcast and answer these questions, who would it be and why? 
 
21:36 - David (Guest)
Hmm, and answer these questions who would it be and why? Hmm, I mentioned earlier about my friend who is the singer who built the recording studio. So his name's Chris Blaine and he's been an a cappella singer quite successful massive in Asia, not so much here and he seems to be connected with all sorts of wonderful individuals in the Australian music industry. But he's been working a lot recently with indigenous communities getting them involved in the powers of music. He's about to take a bunch of old boys over to England to do a tour. Over there they do very, very cheeky, cheeky, cheeky acapella songs. They're a bit of a hoot Men in Suits, I think they're called. But I think I'd like to hear about his challenges with the music industry and then how to impart that knowledge into the next generation and really how you keep your spirits up in an industry that's changed so much. You keep your spirits up in an industry that's changed so much. I can get on the, on the Bjork bandwagon and and slam Spotify and all of that, but everything's changed now. 
 
23:08
So yeah yeah, I'd like to hear his his creative, creative elements in his life in that creative space. Chris Blaine is my answer. 
 
23:20 - Alexis (Host)
Beautiful, I'll write that down. David Cox, thank you so much, my pleasure. For being with us on Through the Creative Door. This has been such a joy and has filled my cup so much. You are a bloody legend. 
 
23:39 - David (Guest)
Thanks for sitting in this dusty space. 
 
23:41 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my goodness, it is glorious. 
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom/throughthecreativedoor or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. Little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favorite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community and we'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

BSIDE Rubber Soul

Featured Artist: The Beatles
Featured Vinyl: Rubber Soul
 
Alexis’ Hot Pick 
You Won’t See Me
Sam’s Hot Pick
If I Needed Someone
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for an artist's vinyl to listen to, have you got one in mind that we should check out? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
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CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Co-Host: Sam Timmerman
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Voiceover: Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
—---------------------
Notes for Sam & Alexis:
Artist
The Beatles
Record Title
Rubber Soul
Vinyl Artwork
“The album cover is another example of our branching out: the stretched photo,” McCartney acknowledged in Anthology. “That was actually one of those little exciting random things that happen. The photographer Robert Freeman had taken some pictures round at John’s house in Weybridge. We had our new gear on – the polo necks – and we were doing straight mug shots; the four of us all posing.”
McCartney added: “Back in London, Robert was showing us the slides; he had a piece of cardboard that was the album-cover size and he was projecting the photographs exactly onto it so we could see how it would look as an album cover. We had just chosen the photograph when the card that the picture was projected onto fell backwards a little, elongating the photograph. It was stretched and we went, ‘That’s it, Rubber So-o-oul, hey hey! Can you do it like that?’ And he said, ‘well, yeah. I can print it that way.’ And that was it.”
Furthermore, George Harrison noted in the same documentary: “I liked the way we got our faces to be longer on the album cover. We lost the ‘little innocents’ tag, the naivety, and Rubber Soul was the first one where we were fully-fledged potheads.”
https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/cover-uncovered-the-beatles-pot-album-rubber-soul/ 
Alexis’ Hot Pick 
You Won’t See Me - just love the call & response & harmonies! And the meaning… 
Written by McCartney, "You Won't See Me" reflects the difficulties he was experiencing in his relationship with actress Jane Asher due to her refusal to put her acting career second to his needs
Sam’s Hot Pick
If I needed someone - fun thematic premise that can allow a million interpretations :) 
(From Beatles Bible)
If I Needed Someone
Written by: Harrison
Recorded: 16, 18 October 1965
Released: 3 December 1965 (UK), 15 June 1966 (US)
Inspired by Roger McGuinn’s guitar work for The Byrds, ‘If I Needed Someone’ was written by George Harrison and first appeared in the UK on the Rubber Soul album.
‘If I Needed Someone’ is like a million other songs written around a D chord. If you move your finger about you get various little melodies. That guitar line, or variations on it, is found in many a song, and it amazes me that people still find new permutations of the same notes.
George Harrison, 1980
‘If I Needed Someone’ was the only one of Harrison’s songs to have become a part of The Beatles’ live repertoire. It is believed to have been performed at every Beatles concert in 1966, and was played at their final show at San Francisco’s Candlestick Park on 29 August 1966.
Studio/Producer
Producer: George Martin
Engineer: Norman Smith
Recording Artists
 
Collabs/Features
 
Fun facts
 
Other Info
00:09 - Intro (Announcement)
Welcome to B-Side, the mini-series from Through the Creative Door. Join Alexis and Sam as they dive into the timeless world of vinyl. For Alexis, vinyl was more than music. It was a Sunday ritual she shared with her dad, listening, talking and soaking in the stories behind each album and the artwork on every sleeve. Though her dad is no longer with us, she continues this tradition with her friend, Sam Timmerman. Join them as they share their passion for vinyl and the stories these records hold. 
 
00:44 - Alexis (Host)
Hello brother, hey, hey, hey how we doing good, how are you? 
 
00:51 - Sam (Host)
I'm good, it's hot today. 
 
00:54 - Alexis (Host)
I've got it's windy and hot here I've got this. I have one of those, but it's sitting somewhere else, it's not on my desk there you go? 
 
01:06 - Sam (Host)
No, it's a bit warm. The blinds are closed, the fan's on, but we're okay. 
 
01:12 - Alexis (Host)
I love it. 
 
01:12 - Sam (Host)
You're going well. You said it's windy over there. 
 
01:14 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, bloody Melbourne, four seasons one day. Just wait long enough. 
 
01:19 - Sam (Host)
Do people listening know that we're on opposite sides of the country? 
 
01:21 - Alexis (Host)
because that's super cool oh yeah, that's, that's true. That's true. 
 
01:26 - Sam (Host)
You're on the western coast, stairs and I'm on the east coast, east Perth western australia oh, my other home. I adore it over there indeed, and we adore you being here as well no stop what are we up to? 
 
01:44 - Alexis (Host)
we are episode four, four, four. All right, that's it. We're gonna do the 10 minute timer so that we don't ramble off and bore everyone listening silly. All right, ready and go. What do you got for me, brother? It go. What do you got for me, brother? Are you ready? 
 
02:09 - Sam (Host)
yeah, I'm ready, ready to receive. Oh yes, rubber soul are these four fantastic? Bowl haircuts oh the one, and only beetles. So good reason why I don't remember. Don't know if you remember. 
 
02:25 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, go. 
 
02:26 - Sam (Host)
Why I chose this? Because I had, like we found out in episode two with the Rolling Stones, I had never listened to a Beatles album top to bottom. 
 
02:35 - Alexis (Host)
Seriously, don't tell me, except for Beatles. 
 
02:40 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, beatles One we had at home when I was growing up. So, all the greatest, the number of times I've performed Beatles tunes, the number of times I've listened to that record, that Beatles 1, I've never listened to an entire album. I know a few musicians locally who will probably bash down the door and throw things at me because of that, but, I'm sorry I love it. 
 
03:09 - Alexis (Host)
That's all right, as long as you know that that is the judgment that you're going to receive. 
 
03:12 - Sam (Host)
That is fun this is the judgment I've been receiving for a long time um, but yes, that vinyl the cover artwork. 
 
03:24 - Alexis (Host)
It's not anyone's eyes. That's a little warped the photo. 
 
03:30 - Sam (Host)
Yes, I heard about that, and I don't remember why. 
 
03:34 - Alexis (Host)
From memory the stretched photo. It was just like a random thing that happened with the photographer that they had when they were taking photos at john's house and I think they just sort of liked how it was the question is did they see the photo and went we've got to call the album rub or something, or yeah? I don't know. Hang on, let me, let me google it,
 
04:02 - Sam (Host)
 let me see what they say the amount of time I spent on beetlesbiblecom. 
Google it, let me see what they say the amount of time I spent on Beatlesbiblecom and I didn't find it but recorded, if I remember correctly, in 1965. 
 
04:13 - Alexis (Host)
Mm-hmm, oh here we go Projecting the photographs exactly onto it to see how it looked on the album cover. We just had chosen the photograph when the card that the picture was projected on fell backwards a little, and that's how it's like. 
 
04:34 - Sam (Host)
Oh, so it's got that bottom-up angle. 
 
04:37 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, and then so they went, it was stretched and we went that's it, rubber soul, hey, hey it actually did. 
 
04:46 - Sam (Host)
I had the album title hmm, there you go on. Artistic people amazing. 
 
04:56 - Alexis (Host)
I love it. I mean, wasn't there a bit of thought that they were a little bit of like fully fledged potheads at that point anyway? So it sort of worked. 
 
05:06 - Sam (Announcement)
I wish. 
 
05:07 - Sam (Host)
I don't know. That would explain a lot, and I love it. 
 
05:13 - Alexis (Host)
Well, I mean, don't throw me under the bus. I might totally have made that up, but I thought at that point that was sort of you. 
 
05:19 - Sam (Host)
You know word on the street again beatlesbiblecom, and let's see what it says eventually but that's okay it's true I had to say I loved listening through this because, even outside of the kind of name tracks you drive my car, norwegian Wood, michelle as well the whole of this album was exactly the sound that I was expecting it to be. Out of all the Beatles tunes that I knew already, it was just this quintessential mid-60s sound. It was just spectacular. And Michelle came up, and the first version of Michelle I'd ever heard was not this one. Oh, I believe it was a Sarah Vaughan version, which was really cool okay, do you have a preference? 
 
06:11
a few years back now. Um, I like this one in. It's a bit more raw, a little bit. A little bit rough around the edges, don't get me wrong. Sarah Vaughan's incredible and you can quote me on that, but I loved this version. It wasn't my hot pick, though. Hot pick was actually If I Needed Someone, which I thought was really cool. 
 
06:37 - Alexis (Host)
Really that's your hot pick yeah. Oh, I love that song. 
06:43 - Sam (Host)
This is, and we keep talking about the fact that I don't listen to lyrics, but it's the third one in a row. 
 
06:50 - Alexis (Host)
See, you just needed some, you know motivation to get all lyric-y. Yes, sir, I love this. Come to the dark side, come to the dark side, come to my side and we may, 
 
07:12 - Sam (Host)
if I can find a way of doing it. I found the original lyric scribble. 
Yeah, the original scribble that George wrote the lyrics with. 
 
07:18 - Alexis (Host)
I'll have to put that on the photo when we post. 
 
07:21 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, we'll see if we can post it, because it's very it's. It just has a little bit of an extra bit of feeling to it, but but if I needed someone to love, you're the one I'd be thinking of. Which is, as a as a theme, as a concept, I think is really way more interesting than it needs to be. If you want to overthink it. I'm like I don't need someone, but if I did, I'm going to be here.
 
07:46 - Alexis (Host)
Well, none of us need someone we don't actually like. Some people don't like too. 
 
07:58 - Sam (Host)
This is turning very quickly into a different conversation. 
 
08:01 - Alexis (Host)
Therapy Wait, wait, how does? 
 
08:05 - Sam (Host)
this make you feel as I put a pen in your mouth. 
 
08:07 - Alexis (Host)
Stop, stop. Don't put glasses on and look down your nose at me. 
 
08:12 - Sam (Host)
I don't have glasses, so I can't do that. That's okay. Did you have a hot pick of your own? 
 
08:17 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, I did, and it would have to be. You Won't See Me, I just froth at that call and response and harmonies in that track. Oh, they just sing.
 
08:35 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, they are amazing. So do you have a hot pick of your own? 
 
10:03 - Alexis (Host)
I do have a hot pick. It is you Won't See Me, and I truly just love the call and response and the harmonies. They just pun, not intended, but sing at me, not not intended, but still yeah, but as a true lyricist, I just also dive into the meaning and you know, concept. So my understanding is that McCartney wrote it as a bit of a reflection, because he was having difficulties with a relationship at the time. 
 
And my understanding is that the relationship was with an actor. I'm not sure I know too much about her. I think she an actress named Jane Asher. 
 
11:02 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, but my understanding is that her refusal to put her acting career second to his needs was like a true you know, pull, push, pull right. Which is where this sort of which is why I think the call and response thing sort of works, when you think that someone's more demanding and wants more and wants you to give up something for yourself. 
 
11:25 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, Well, I mean with a quick Google. The relationship must have started working again a little bit, because they were together for three years after this album was released. 
 
11:35 - Alexis (Host)
Oh really. 
 
11:36 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, 1963 to 1968., Thank you, Wikipedia and Google once again, Make sure you donate to Wikipedia. I've said that before.
 
11:45 - Alexis (Host)
Not sponsored. 
 
11:47 - Sam (Host)
Not sponsored. Hashtag not sponsored. She was in death at a funeral, apparently. 
 
11:53 - Alexis (Host)
Okay, I am really bad with movies and. 
 
11:57 - Sam (Host)
Me too. That's why I use Google. 
 
12:00 - Alexis (Host)
I meant more that, like, I very rarely have time to watch that kind of stuff but when I do, I like get really into it. 
 
12:06
But yeah, not, I'm not fully familiar with her work but um, but I can appreciate and I think you know the artist way is that it's really difficult yes, people who really understand the push-pull of this creative life that we have, and you would think that you would find an ally in someone else who is an actor versus a musician, or actress and musician. But clearly there's still tension, something there yeah, tension, it's fun. 
 
12:41 - Sam (Host)
You talked about the vocal harmonies, though, because, listening through the record, I had the beautiful little happy moment of won't see me and nowhere man. Back to back, back to back the backing vocals are both the same. 
 
12:56 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, yeah. 
 
12:58 - Sam (Host)
Ooh, la, la, la. La, la, la, yeah la la, la, la, la, la, la la. And I was just like, yes, we're in the 60s, let's go. 
 
13:06 - Alexis (Host)
But part of that is the fact that your ears already know, like I would suggest, that most people, the kids coming up, you know they wouldn't even need to have known all of these songs, and your brain knows where to go, knows where those harmonies, where those call and responses are. 
 
13:27 - Sam (Host)
Yeah. 
 
13:28 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah. I love it, Love it. 
 
13:29 - Sam (Host)
I also found, you know. The last thing that I wrote down because I found it interesting was that Going Back to Needed Someone is the only one of George Harrison's songs that became part of their live rep. 
 
13:52 - Alexis (Host)
Oh really. 
 
13:53 - Sam (Host)
Only song that George wrote. That was in their live rep Okay, and it was played at Candlestick on 1966, august. It was believed to have been performed at every Beatles concert in 66 and was played at their final show. 
 
14:12 - Sam (Host)
It's the only one that George wrote that ever went into the live show. 
 
14:16 - Alexis (Host)
Wow. 
 
14:18 - Sam (Host)
And it's one that I had not heard before. I listened to this record
 
14:20 - Alexis (Host)
See, this is why this game is fun. 
 
14:25 - Sam (Host)
We do this. 
 
14:26 - Alexis (Host)
This is why we talk to people and talk to each other. 
 
14:31 - Alexis (Host)
That's time, timer, time time we're done we're done, thank you for getting my butt into gear about records, because I'm not again. First time I'd listened to a beatles record top to bottom and that was great wow, look, that's what a sister's here for it's true, very true all, right 
15:00 - Alexis (Host)
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom/throughthecreativedoor or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favorite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community and we'll catch you on your favorite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

4 | Just Keep Creating with Hannah Crofts aka Baby Velvet

In this episode, we sit down with Hannah Crofts, best known as a member of the acclaimed Australian folk group All Our Exes Live in Texas and for her captivating solo project, Baby Velvet. Beyond the harmonies and stage lights, Hannah offers a raw and insightful look into the realities of life as an artist—the creative highs, the crushing self-doubt, and the ever-present pressure to turn passion into profit. We dive into her journey through the music industry, the moments that tested her resilience, and the lessons that keep her grounded. From embracing uncertainty to finding joy in the process, this conversation is a must-listen for anyone navigating the fine line between creativity and sustainability. 
If you’d like to see more, you can follow Hannah Crofts on instagram; @ babyvelvetmusic
 
This episode was recorded on 12 January 2025 on the lands of the Woiworung Peoples. We hope that this episode inspires you as a creative person and as a human being.
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for creative people to share their story and inspire others. Have you got someone in mind who would love to have a chat? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
…
Creative resources: A Swim In A Pond In The Rain - George Saunders 
Adrienne Linker's School of Song 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikToc: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
00:09 - Alexis (Host)
Hello, my name is Alexis Naylor and I am your host here at Through the Creative Door. On behalf of myself and my guests, I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. Owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. May we pay our respects to all First Nations people and acknowledge Elders, past and present. On this podcast, I'll be chatting to an array of creative guests, getting a glimpse into their worlds and having some honest and inspiring conversations along the way. I'm delighted to welcome you to Through the Creative Door. 
Oh, my goodness, Hannah, I'm so excited to be chatting with you. Thank you for coming on Through the Creative Door. 
 
00:57 - Hannah (Guest) 
Thank you so much for having me. 
 
00:59 - Alexis (Host) 
I know I'm so chuffed. So nice Fangirling right over here. This is so cute, cute, yes, um, before we get in and launch into all these lovely doubly questions um, you are such a talented bear, you are such a such a glorious performer and you really have such a beautiful stage presence. 
 
01:21
Um, I really love your latest single, which I got to see that live, actually with you singing with a choir that you put together, which was glorious. 
 
01:34 - Hannah (Guest)
I'm so lucky that you came. Thank you for coming. 
 
01:37 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, it's so beautiful. It's so beautiful. It's such a beautiful energy in the room which you have cultivated. 
 
01:40 - Hannah (Guest)
That was very special, that show. It was very special, it was real nice. 
 
01:53 - Alexis (Host)
But apart from you being a very talented musician, you also do amazing collage um mural and yeah, that kind of work, yeah, which I'm fascinated to pick your brain about. Like how does one get into that? Like how did that spark I? 
 
02:01 - Hannah (Guest)
That one's a bit strange. I was thinking about this the other day and I'm a musician, but then I also just spend so much time drawing and then that kind of turned from there, just got interested in collage. And then do you know Emily Lubitz, who's in Tin Pan Orange and she's also a performer in her own right. She's a beautiful musician, she lives up in Byron, um, and she asked me to make a video clip for her, maybe like three years ago, and I never thought about doing it. But she was like I love your drawings, like maybe you could just make me something cool, and so I spent maybe two months like learning how to use some software and I made like a very beautiful video clip for her. That's very. 
 
02:43
I just feel like if someone who knew how to use the software would be like oh, that'd take me 15 minutes, but it took me two months of being like stop frame animation kind of thing. And then emily's partner is Harry from the cat empire, and the cat empire's management bought a warehouse in collingwood and made a giant exhibition about love and sex cool, and they had these three phone booths and they asked Emily who they should get to deck, like just to do smart in the phone booth, so Emily recommended me. There's a long way of saying that I've got into. There's an exhibition that I just completed, in December, and that was through Emily recommended me through making her the video clip. 
 
03:19 - Alexis (Host)
That's sick and that's through. Is it Museum of? I don't know why I said pleasure, it was something like that. I remember Museum of it's called Museum of Desire. Oh Desire. I don't know why I said pleasure, I thought it was something like that. I remember seeing. 
03:29 - Hannah (Guest) 
Yeah, there's a lot about pleasure in Desire. 
But there's like 25 artists, I think, and so you walk around. It takes like an hour and you do all the different exhibitions. 
 
03:39 - Alexis (Host) 
Oh my goodness, I need to go. It's very fun. It very fun. It's very nude. You say a lot of nudity.
 
03:45 - Alexis (Host)
I love nudity, then you'll love the exhibition. Excellent, alexa I. I just think that the body, it's such a beautiful shape yeah, yeah, especially women's bodies. 
 
03:52 - Hannah (Guest)
Women's bodies, right stunning. 
 
03:55 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, so we are in your beautiful space, so I'm curious whether your answer will be this space or a different space, or a frame of mind. But what does a creative space mean to you and why? 
 
04:09 - Hannah (Guest)
um, creative space means so much to me, as you can say by how I've decorated my room, but, um, my, I was on tour with my band for 10 years. So I play in a band called all our exes live in Texas, and we were on tour from for, yeah, for most of my 20s, and so I didn't have a home for that time. We were just away and I lived out of a suitcase for a lot of it and I just like, once we stopped touring, it just became so important to me to have like a sacred space that was just mine especially. I know that you've toured before like just how much. You never have any alone time. You never have anything that's yours. 
 
04:47
I'm from a family of three, I'm one of four girls um, that that makes me sound a bit crazy, but I just love having a space that is just mine and that is very special, and so, um, I do all of my work in this room and I spend so much time just like curating it and thinking about it and making just a space where you can actually think and create art. 
 
05:10 - Alexis (Host)
And there's something about like that calm. Yeah, that just lets you drop in. I'm projecting a little bit here but I can. I can drop in to that creative when everything else is calm yeah, 
 
05:16 - Hannah (Guest)
Which I always think if I ever had a partner, we have to have separate bedrooms because they cannot put their stuff in this room. I like my stuff too much and I like the layout too much that I'd be like no, like what if they brought an ugly lamp? I wouldn't know how to. Maybe this is why I don't have a partner, because I'm like your stuff's ugly, you can't bring it in 
 
05:40 - Alexis (Host)
But there's the schools for thought about people who have like separate bedrooms. I think, yeah, I think that's a vibe? 
 
05:41 - Hannah (Guest)
I think, think so too. I just think I have to meet someone who's got lots of money so we can have a glorious big house where we can have lots of our own spaces. 
 
05:47 - Alexis (Host)
Studio yes, exactly. Drawing room yeah, extra bedrooms Amazing. Now, if we talk about your stuff, is there a body of work or a project that you're the most proud of creating, of creating and like how did that come about? 
 
06:10 - Hannah (Guest)
um, I think I'm most proud of Virtuous, which I just put out, which I know is just one song on its own. But, um, so I was in X's for 10 years and then COVID happened and we decided to go forth and do our solo projects and I recorded a record and at the time, I was supposed to go to LA and record it. Um, with the producer that I worked with called Kevin, and maybe like March of 2020, I moved into my sister's bungalow because I was like, I'm gonna save my money, I'm gonna go overseas, I'll go to LA, I'll record this record. And then COVID happened. And so my poor sister. I was like, can I stay for two weeks before I go to to LA? I'll record this record. And then COVID happened. And so my poor sister. I was like, can I stay for two weeks before I go to America? And I was like, can I stay for a year? And I just never moved out of her bungalow for one year, um, and never made it to America. 
 
06:54
But so Kevin and I made the record over Zoom in the end, so we decided to do it anyway and we did a whole. 
 
07:01
So, yeah, I've made one solo record, and it was just all over the internet, which was amazing in that we could still create something, and we created something we both loved. I would never do that again in like, uh, you know, one of the most beautiful things about making a record is well, for me, anyway, is the community and like having people there and getting to create something together. And while Kevin was there over the internet, if I made a record again, I would love to have a producer in the room with me, being like, why don't we try this? Maybe try that again, which, in the case of my record, I just recorded. I learned how to record and I recorded all my parts myself, and then I would send him like 20 takes and he would comp something together, or like so yeah, like, I just did a lot of that, which just also drives you insane, because you're in alone in your bedroom singing the same line over and over again, being like, was that good, was that better? Like, is this bit? 
 
07:50 - Alexis (Host)
yeah, there's something nice about having that immediate feedback of like, okay, great, but like, maybe, like, um, work on this part of your diction, on this part. Or like, yeah, just be maybe not as harsh on this bit. Or yeah, you get that and you can start to adjust it. As opposed to, yeah, doing 20 takes and then a couple of days later, getting am I okay, this is fine, I'm actually really bad at this. 
 
08:13 - Hannah (Guest)
Like what am I like you inspire really quickly, versus having someone be like no, you're fine, just keep going, like don't worry about it. Yeah, um
 
08:18 - Alexis (Host)
I think you're just gonna keep running it a few more times, you're fine. 
 
08:21 - Hannah (Guest)
You're fine. So I made that and I am really proud of that and I love that record. But I think you know it wasn't the dream process to make it. It was like a learning curve and I learned a lot. And then, when I made Virtuous, I did the Adrienne Linker songwriting course last year for School of Songs. She did a one-month course on the internet and I wrote that song as part of that course and I just really loved the song and I felt really proud of it. 
 
08:46
And then, um, I recorded it myself, which also I've never I've never released anything that I've recorded just on my own, which was a big thing in my mind of like a barrier for music for me is money. I mean, like, how do I keep releasing music and how do I keep making art and how do I keep funneling all my money into it, and you know, and so it was cool to be like, oh, you can just create stuff yourself and put it out. And then I got my friends to come and sing on that. So all the backing vocals are a bunch of mates. And then my housemate is a videographer, so he came down to from his bedroom to my bedroom and we filmed a clip and then I put on a show which felt like in for me it felt like a community event of all my friends coming together and celebrating. So I felt really proud of that of like. 
 
09:28
How do you move forward in the music industry and keep creating and being happy without burning out and without making like? I don't know, it's just such a strange industry of like. How can I make sure that I'm one being creative but two, fulfilling that part of you that wants to release music and like have people hear it. 
 
09:44 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, and also not letting go of the fact that we still are human and, yeah, you know someone's friend, someone's sister still wanting to go on holidays and have a weekend away oh my gosh, exactly like have a life, yes, yeah, yes. 
 
09:58 - Hannah (Guest)
And I just like being like I only have you know x amount of money in a year. I would like to. I've spent the last 10 years just putting that into music and then just being like, oh, but like it would be really nice to go on a holiday, like it would be nice to go overseas or whatever it is, and be like, yeah, prioritizing different things, I don't know, but then still getting to do that creative things that you want to do, yeah, yeah. So I think Virtuous is what I'm most proud of. 
 
10:22 - Alexis (Host)
Well, it's a banger. A banger on the flip side of things that you're proud of. What, if you have one, or maybe you have a few is there something that's challenged your creativity, and what do you think the major lesson of that has been? 
 
10:42 - Hannah (Guest)
I think, uh, probably just my self-esteem has challenged my creativity. You know, like self-doubt and like, um self-sabotage. I think, um, yeah, I think that'll always be the hardest thing for me and as I've gotten older, being like don't worry so much, I actually think sorry. My best piece of advice is that everything is a stepping stone to the next thing. So I think with music and records and songs, you can get really bogged down and being like it has to be perfect, this I'm putting all my eggs in this basket of making this one beautiful record and it's going to represent me and it's everyone's going to judge me based on it. 
 
11:17
And I have to put, and I and I do think you should create the best thing you can create, but you should think about it like I'm creating the best thing I can create in this moment and it doesn't summarize me forever. 
 
11:27
It's not the only thing that'll ever happen in my life. It doesn't. It just summarizes who I am in this moment, um, and so don't feel so stressed to put things out and don't feel so like I just feel like we all get bogged down in this idea that sometimes it takes years to put things out and I can overthink things and I can rework them and just like, actually don't worry about it, just put it out. If you're happy with it, obviously, and you love it, just put it out and know that it's not the only thing you're going to do. That's a step, yeah, everything is a stepping stone to the next thing you're going to create Adrienne, like it was really great in her course where she was like we're all just writing the same song over and over and over again to try and get the perfect song oh, I like that well. 
 
12:06
I feel that's so true. I do think I just write the same song over and over and over again and you are just trying to like work on your chip away and work on your craft and until you write a song and maybe you'll never think you've written the perfect song. But other people will, you know? I think Adrienne Link has written, you know, 2000 perfect songs. Yeah, but I guess that's yeah, striving to keep being better. 
 
12:21 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, and I also think we're always trying to find a way to process the things happening around us and, yeah, that vessel of creating art is how we have digested it and putting it back into the world. 
 
12:40 - Hannah (Guest)
Right, totally yeah therapy, oh my god how great is art for therapy. Every time I go through a breakup it's so cliched but I'm like at least I got a couple good songs out of that, yeah, you know right that man wasn't very nice, but whatever, got some good songs 
 
12:56 - Alexis (Host) 
I swear I've done that with so much dating. 
I was like, yeah, I got, I got some, got some content, yeah, yeah we did it for the plot, for the plot story 
 
13:01 - Hannah (Guest) 
Because I also think, like two years later you can't remember the man that you went on that two months date with, but you have the song still yeah, you know, and it's disassociated from that man, but you still have the art yeah, it's great. 
 
13:12 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, for sure, for sure, for sure. It's like oh honey, it might have started because of you, but it's not about you it's not about you. 
 
13:19 - Hannah (Guest)
I don't remember you are. 
 
13:26 - Alexis (Host)
You have such beautiful things in this room. I wonder do you have any object or thing or belonging that you can't live without when you create? 
 
13:39 - Hannah (Guest)
When I make things? I have a little morning ritual, which I started last year and again it was like the thought process of like what kind of artist am I going to be and how can I be happy is a bigger thought of artist am I going to be and who, how can I be happy, is a bigger sort. 
 
13:58
And so every morning I have one hour before I leave the house or do something where I have to be creative, and that to me is like gardening or watering the garden or reading a book or. But, yeah, I feel like it's um, yeah, very, I don't know, it's probably cringy to some people, but like I burn my sage, I light a little candle, I have beautiful notebooks, I have beautiful pens and I just sit down and try and journal, um, and just try and start my day with a moment of being creative. Um, so the things I can't live without, it's just like a pen and paper or a book or a. You know I can live without sage and candle, but I think it is, I think the ritual of getting into a habit of doing it every day and reminding yourself of it every day 
14:39 - Alexis (Host) 
And do you think that that ritual, it also just sits you in that intention like a headspace a frame of mind? 
 
14:46 - Hannah (Guest) 
just a reminder as well. I did another School of Song with Dr Dog, with Scott McKinnon Mick Mckinnon, who is one of my favourite songwriters and he, you know, we all know this and it's so true. But being like, if you want to be creative, there's only very few moments in your life that you feel inspired. You know that you come home and you're like I actually really feel like creating art and if you want to be creative, you know you can look at it like a job. Job makes it not sound very romantic. But being like I'm just going to be something I'm going to do every day and I'm going to commit to doing it every day, um, even if I don't really feel like it, cause I'm really not going to feel inspiration that often or all the time. 
 
15:25 - Alexis (Host)
Well, a lot can be said for just having the structure. Yeah, because then when you quote unquote, don't feel as inspired, you still have that structure of like okay, well, I'm gonna sit in this space and I'm doing this for an hour and yeah, so you help supporting that even for the times where you don't have those. I mean, I always find it funny that, like we all know of artists, where you know they're like oh, I sat down and wrote this song in five minutes, it just came to me, which we all know. 
 
15:53 - Hannah (Guest)
Dolly Parton, I will always love you. 
 
15:54 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, like there are, there are times when you get that beautiful, you know being struck by lightning, yeah, but more often than not it's like um, his name, um, ed sheeran he talks about, like you, running the, the tap. Like, yeah, you just constantly just keep writing, keep doing, keep creating, um, because you sort of almost have to, yeah, get all the crap out before you'll get to the good stuff. 
 
16:20 - Hannah (Guest)
Absolutely. I always know that I'll write two crap songs, maybe five, maybe ten crap songs to one song that I actually like, and so you have to sit through all the crap songs to get to the one that you're like, all right, this is fine. 
 
16:28 - Alexis (Host)
yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly if you could give one piece of advice, one nugget of gold, to another creative. Actually, it was interesting. The people that I've interviewed just recently, they actually, instead of it just being to another creative, they're like what would I say to myself? But uh, yeah, what advice or nugget of gold would you give, and what would, yeah, and what would it be?
 
16:57 - Hannah (Guest)
 I think it'd be. This is like very specific to me at the moment, but I've become addicted to that song, the Sunscreen song, which is a Baz Luhrmann song. It was famous in like 19, I think it's 1997. 
 
17:09 - Alexis (Host) 
Is it the one that they speak the lyrics? 
 
17:12 - Hannah (Guest) 
And it's like to the class of like 1997 or like whatever. Maybe it's 1999. 
 
17:15 - Alexis (Host)
And it's like to the class of like 1997 or like whatever. Maybe it's 1999, but one of the bits of advice wear sunscreen. Yes, um, yeah, yeah, and it goes through, like all these different situations about yeah, yeah 
 
17:21 - Hannah (Guest) 
And it's beautiful and it gives some beautiful advice in that, and like, one thing that I would say to my younger self and to myself now, which I try and do is, um, like, just never compare yourself to others or their art journey like their, their creative journey. 
 
17:33 - Alexis (Host)
Which is really hard to do with social media the way that it is. 
 
17:36 - Hannah (Guest)
It's so revolting and so hard and it's just like social media is so fake and I just I have people in my you know wider life where you're like your social media is going off and you look like you're doing all the best things in the world and then personally you're having a really terrible time. And you know vice versa, like people can be having the best time of their life and not putting it on social media, but it makes everyone feel bad about themselves and their careers all the time. Um, so I guess, yeah, just like the knock comparison is the thief of thief of joy. Is that the saying yes? 
I think that's a big thing to try and learn, that. I still try and learn every day of been like so much of the music industry and music careers are beyond your control. It's not about your talent, it is a wide variety of other things, and just enjoy the journey. Yeah, that you're on. I know that sounds so corny. 
 
18:27 - Alexis (Host)
No, but it's yeah it is true, and I also think you know all of us want to be here for a long time, not for, you know, we don't want to burn ourselves out and yeah, we've got to be able to find and I think we're all trying to actually get that out but find a way to sustain it. yeah, for like the long term, not just for now. 
 
18:44 - Hannah (Guest)
I think a really big lesson that I learned from being in a band for so long um, which, I think about, is a big. I loved being in that band and it's you know, we did so many amazing things. The mentality that I had was always about the bigger picture, like I always like we're striving towards these massive goals all the time and I think having massive goals is amazing and we should all have have them. But it also really taught me that for me, the most important thing is to have a good day, like to wake up and be like how can I make my day really good and if I'm going to bed at night and I've had a really nice day, then I've won. 
 
19:21
Yeah, versus being like I might have 20 crappy days in a row, but they're all working towards this bigger picture thing. That doesn't matter. Yeah, because if you haven't crap day, what's the point? I don't know that. That took me to live it, to learn it. Yeah, so my days are really gorgeous. I make good days. Yeah, and I have bigger picture goals that you that I'm still working towards, but like it's less. It's less driven by that, I guess yeah. 
 
19:46 - Alexis (Host)
You've mentioned a few sort of resources or um courses and and things just in our chat already. But apart from obviously you're an advocate for doing songwriting retreats and songwriting courses and stuff, but would you recommend any other resources? Um, if someone wanted to develop their creative process and do what you do? 
 
20:14 - Hannah (Guest)
There is a book that I read last year called swim in a pond in the rain. Um, I have to look up what the man's name is, like Gregory something, but that was a beautiful book, um, that I would recommend reading if you want to do songwriting, specifically lyrical songwriting. But, um, it was a book where it breaks down five like old russian stories, and the writer talks. He doesn't have complicated language, so he is a philosopher and a phd major in english and he just basically breaks down the stories and tells you why sentences work and what they make the reader feel. And then, um, yeah, I guess like how you can shape a story to make people feel different things and but, yeah, again, talks to you in layman's terms so you don't feel like it's too complicated or don't understand or um, and it's a beautiful book for songwriting. 
 
21:06
I just did lots of last year, lots of trying to read it and then put it into songwritings where you have verses where you try and match it. I've been like, okay, he's talking about, if you do, sentences like structural sentences like this, or this story made me feel this way like how do you, if you only have six verses, like, how do I structure it so I can make it feel the same. So I found that really useful to try and think about. Not that I've achieved it, but it was beautiful um. 
 
21:27 - Alexis (Host)
well, it's nice when you read things where it gets you to just think about your process of writing a little differently. 
 
21:37 - Hannah (Guest)
Yes, yeah. And then I got this book, which is a complete rhyming dictionary which I use all the time Because, again, I write the same song over and over and over. So this was a good book to buy and be like, start changing. You use these words all the time, so what's other words for those words? You know, I think I need that. I just I do fall on the same catalogue of like words. So this was, this was good, um. 
 
22:03
Other resources, school, yeah, as I said, school of songs, really amazing, um, there's a artist called lord cowboy who she did that picture on that wall, um, and she's on instagram and she just is like a. I find her very inspiring. She on that wall, um, and she's on instagram and she just is like a. I find her very inspiring. She makes art every day and she puts it up. She's not a songwriter, she's a visual artist, but at the moment she's like running a retreat online to get off social media and you meet up with her on zoom once a week and talk about not being online, like unplugging, and the relationship, yeah, of being an artist on social media but also just being an artist in the world. Um, yeah, I reckon those are my main ones. 
 
22:41 - Alexis (Host)
Amazing, I think, this last one that you're mentioning. I mean, it's so true, I think we get so caught up with the deliverables um of, yeah, result driven, yeah, case in point posting or showing art or whatever on social media. So, yeah, it's like you're still an artist, even if no one can see the process and what you're up to at that point. 
 
23:00 - Hannah (Guest)
Well, it is an interesting thought of like what age was I told that if I like art, I should monetize it. You know, and being like I've lived that way for so long, I've been like everything I do should have value into my career, uh, and eventually, yeah, my income. And they've been like I can just create art because I want to create art, not because I want to make money off it. Obviously would love to make money off art, but at the same time, it's so nice being able to create art, not with that intention yeah, yeah. 
 
23:25 - Alexis (Host)
And what's that? Um, you know when they talk about, you know intentions and it's like, whether it's like um working on your like career moving forward, or if it like fills your cup, or it's like the financial, it's like you're never going to have all three. Yeah, like overlay, it's like, but at least if you've got one or two of them, then you're doing pretty well then, you're doing okay. 
 
23:48 - Hannah (Guest)
it's good. I like that. Yeah, this year was my. My new year's resolution this year is to make no adult decisions. Oh, I like that. All I did last year was be an adult, and that's great. You need to be an adult sometimes. I ticked a bunch of stuff off. I got out of debt, I like got a car, I did things, and this year, none of it. I'm not making any adult decisions. 
 
24:06 - Alexis (Host)
I love this so much. I'm curious of like how did that sort of philosophy come about? 
 
24:13 - Hannah (Guest)
I just in my mind was like you know what do one year on, one year off? Like just be an adult. One year don't be an adult. The next year don't worry about it, it's fine. So I just want to spend all my money this year going overseas and holidays, and I think part of it is that thought of being a grown-up. When you go to the pub and you're like, no, I should go home. But, this year I want to do more like no, no, I'm going to stay out. Let's just see what happens. 
 
24:39 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, what do they say? Nothing good happens after 12 o'clock. It's like to hell it is. I'm staying out all night. 
 
24:43 -  Hannah (Guest)
Just with the riffraff floating around. 
 
24:48 - Alexis (Host) 
I love it. We'll just like not see on social media you overseas, because you'll be offline.
 
24:52 - Hannah (Guest)
Exactly, living my life. It's not showing everyone. 
 
24:55 - Alexis (Host)
I love it. If you could hear another creative on this podcast and answer these questions. Who would it be and why? 
 
25:06 - Hannah (Guest)
I know I've already talked about him. I'll talk about two. One is Amy Sedaris, who's American, and she isn't a songwriter, but she's a creative. She makes lots of stuff. She makes similarly sorry, like I make songs, but then I also make visual art. I, um, I feel like Amy is the same in that she just does a whole variety of different things and her mind is so crazy and so wonderful and so funny. 
 
25:33 - Alexis (Host)
Isn't it glorious when you watch people like that, like who are you? 
 
25:34 - Hannah (Guest)
no, I mean, that was another part of my thoughts going into this year was like sometimes those people like, do you know, cola scoza? Like I'm like you're so weird and funny and wonderful and there would have been a long period of time that you were just cringy, like you wouldn't have been good at your craft yet and people around you would have been like, oh, I don't know, that was like a bit strange. But then you come out the other side and you're phenomenal at the thing you do and I feel like amy's the same, where they're just like absolutely amazing at the thing they do. And if you ever want to be that amazing, just don't just be cringe, be weird, like just go delve into it. But I love any time I hear Amy talk like I'm obsessed with everything she says. 
 
26:12
And Scott Mick McKinnon, who's in Dr Dog. I love hearing him talk about music, I love hearing his writing process. I think it is because one of the reasons is because I don't think of music as a solo practice. I think about it as a community thing, like I only like making music to play it with my friends. I hate playing solo shows. I don't like doing it by myself.
 
26:34 - Alexis (Host)
Interesting. The reason why I say interesting is because I feel exactly the same way and I was in a band for a really long time and really loved it, and that was my family, my community, and then those boys all decided to, their paths were different and so that you know, changed everything and for a long time I just wanted the same thing again and I was at a precipice at one point where I had to let go Okay, well, what can I control? Well, I can't necessarily control the people. That if it will work in another project like that, yeah, I can control just doing stuff on my own, but yeah. 
 
27:13 - Hannah (Guest)
But do I want to? 
 
27:15 - Alexis (Host)
It was a struggle for a really long time to find some kind of peace and enjoyment of it. Yeah, being on a stage, a big stage on my own, yeah, yeah, nowadays I can hold space for it and enjoy it for what it is. But yeah, I really hear you when you say like it's about the people you get to share it with. 
 
27:34 - Hannah (Guest)
Yeah, because, yeah, I do play solo and it's like the same thing, like I've done it enough now that I can like go. Like same thing, like I've done it enough now that I can like go and have a good time and I know what I'm doing, but just feel like I write songs in my mind with being like, but I want to play them with other people, I want to sing with other people, I want this. And Scott McKinnon is in Dr Dog, which is a large band, and just like all their live shows, like 10 people on stage and they're obviously best friends. They've been best friends forever. They're all interacting with each other and like that is actually the philosophy of music that I this is why I do it, this is what I love watching, and so I love hearing him talk about how he creates those spaces and, you know, plays with his friends and, yeah, it's beautiful. I don't do anything by myself yeah.  
 
28:12 - Alexis (Host)
Well, it's just, yeah, part of it's the journey, right, yeah, it's, it's all part of it. 
 
28:19 - Hannah (Guest)
I just also. I just don't have. I guess I have a bit because I, you know, I clearly love to be in front of people and like, love people to love me. But I don't have it fully inbuilt in me that I want to be the star like I'd love, rather like, like exes was. I'd rather be the star with a group of people you know still want to be a star, happy to share the spotlight yes, yeah, 
 
28:44 - Alexis (Host)
well, I alsp, I don't know if you're the same, but I'm not a true extrovert. So, having that community on stage to share the load, absolutely that energy out, yeah, and to bring that, so when I'm a bit depleted, you have those other people to help you and then, like, restore it. That's because, yeah, yeah, I mean I can turn it on when I need to, but there are times where it's hard going 
 
29:10 - Hannah (Guest)
And it's so nice, like on X’s shows. We did so many shows for so long and there'd be nights like you get broken up with just before you walk on stage and you could be like cheeky babies, I'm not really feeling this tonight, and they'll be like no worries, and then they'll take the leads on stuff and you could just, but when you're doing it on your own you're like, okay, dig, dig, you got to be, you got to put on the show. Showbiz baby. 
 
29:25 - Alexis (Host)
It's so true, so true, oh, my goodness. Oh, I'm just it's making me think of um. I did a concept album, um, which was about my uh, big relationship breakdown and I just remember that was such heavy content and big relationship breakdown, and I just remember that was such heavy content. And, yeah, there were just times where, like you had to really that psyching in to tour that. Oh, sometimes it was just like so unbearably heavy. 
 
29:51 - Hannah (Guest)
I know that's the thing about writing songs about your heartbreak. Yeah. All right, I guess I'll rehash this tonight, cool. 
 
29:59 - Alexis (Host)
Cool, cool, cool, cool. And we're going back in there. 
 
30:01 - Hannah (Guest)
No, worries, no big deal, it's totally fine. 
 
30:05 - Alexis (Host)
Oh my goodness, Hannah, this has been such a beautiful chat. Thank you so much for coming. 
 
30:10 - Hannah (Guest)
You're so wonderful at this
 
30:12 - Alexis (Host)
oh stop.  I just love a chat. I love a chat. You're very good at chatting. Thank you for coming through the creative door.
30:18 - Hannah (Guest) 
Thank you for having me
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of through the creative door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffee.com/throughthecreativedoor or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favourite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

BSIDE Sunset Cities

Featured Artist: So.Crates, Nelson Dialect & Alnitak Kid
Featured Vinyl: Sunset Cities
 
Alexis’ Hot Pick 
Oh Baby (feat. Jace XL)
Sam’s Hot Pick
6-2-6
 
Aus Music Alert! Support this artists by purchasing this record via Bandcamp:
https://bedroomsuckrecords.bandcamp.com/album/sunset-cities  
 
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for an artist's vinyl to listen to, have you got one in mind that we should check out? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Co-Host: Sam Timmerman
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Voiceover: Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
00:09 - (Announcement)
Welcome to B-Side, the mini-series from Through the Creative Door. Join Alexis and Sam as they dive into the timeless world of vinyl. For Alexis, vinyl was more than music. It was a Sunday ritual she shared with her dad, listening, talking and soaking in the stories behind each album and the artwork on every sleeve. Though her dad is no longer with us, she continues this tradition with her friend, Sam Timmerman. Join them as they share their passion for vinyl and the stories these records hold. 
 
00:44 - Alexis (Host)
Hello Sam. 
 
00:46 - Sam (Host)
Hello, how are we? 
 
00:48 - Alexis (Host)
Good, better in seeing you, my love. 
 
00:52 - Sam (Host)
Thank you and returning the favour. Returning the thought 
 
00:54 - Alexis (Host)
We are good and we are up to episode three. 
 
01:04 - Sam (Host)
Three, three. Which one are you doing that one? 
 
01:06 - Alexis (Host)
Three Wait, which way are you meant to do it? 
 
01:09 - Sam (Host)
Three it's not meant to. It depends if we're watching it very fast or not. 
 
01:12 - Alexis (Host)
Oh my God, I love that movie and he's like Right, there's that, yeah, but we are here to talk about another album this week. 
 
01:21 - Sam (Host)
We are. Actually this one ,it’s my turn
 
01:28 - Alexis (Host)
What is it? Oh wait, let me start the timer, don't show it yet. No, okay, go. 
 
01:30 - Sam (Host)
Ready. I'm ready for 10 minutes. To start it. Look at this. 
 
01:33 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, this is so pretty. 
 
01:37 - Sam (Host)
It's an album called Sunset Cities and I bought this because of that. 
 
01:43 - Alexis (Host)
The picture. 
 
01:44 - Sam (Host)
I had no idea what I was getting. 
 
01:46 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah. 
 
01:48 - Sam (Host)
Saw the sunset picture and I went this is gorgeous, let's buy this. 
 
01:52 - Alexis (Host)
Do you know what I absolutely love? When you shot this through to me to say this is the record, I was so stoked that it's actually Australian artists. Absolutely stoked. It's a collaboration of three different Australian artists actually and it's on Bandcamp. 
 
02:11 - Sam (Host)
So if anyone wants, it's on Bandcamp available now and I think what I saw is there may be, at time of recording, about 20 physical copies left, Mm On the current run. 
 
02:22 - Alexis (Host)
Have you got a number? Does it tell you what number out of the collection you are? 
 
02:27 - Sam (Host)
No. 
 
02:28 - Alexis (Host)
Oh. 
 
02:29 - Sam (Host)
I could make it up. 
 
02:31 - Alexis (Host)
No, don't do that. 
 
02:34 - Sam (Host)
But I got the best surprise, because now, those of you who are listening and not watching, what are you doing? 
 
02:44 - Alexis (Host)
Because you miss out on our beautiful faces, but also, oh my good lord, this is an orange vinyl. Orange vinyl. It is absolutely stunning. That is stunning. That is so pretty. 
 
03:03 - Sam (Host)
I think I sent you a video when I first pulled it out and I had to stop myself because I just went no, no, we have to do this properly to be honest, you were like you're a bit excited that video very excited. Yeah, this is sunset cities. Um, now the artists will need to forgive me if I pronounce it wrong, but so karate's? So Dr Socrates? Yeah, alan Attack Kid and Nussan Dialect produced this for Bedroom Suck Records, which is based out of Brisbane, I believe. 
 
03:40 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, it is in Brisbane. They do quite a lot of hip-hop and that kind of genre. 
 
03:50 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, heaps of MCs, heaps of Brisbane MCs actually on that label. Super cool. 
 
03:54 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, it's so lovely to be able to highlight a, you know Australian record. 
 
04:01 - Sam (Host)
It's so lovely. And this record again. I had bought it on the premise of the artwork being cool. I hadn't even looked at the back of the leaf. Poured out the orange vinyl, went, went, oh my god, and then stuck it on and it I just melted the. You look at that cover and you go no, this is what that music is meant to sound like. It is peak sunset groove, sunrise, sunset groove. Because I love the concept of it being not just let's get some artists and let's write about sunrise, sunset, but the concept of each side of the record is specifically your sunrise side, sunset side. Really cool, and I'm I'm not great at listening to lyrics, as we know from the best of times, but the odd thing will jump out at me even when I'm just sitting back and listening to all the synth grooves. And it's been really great getting to know this album. 
 
05:00 - Alexis (Host)
It's been on repeat at my house and my earworm. My hot pick is Oh Baby. That that is, I reckon, the bee's knees for me on this record. 
 
05:19 - Sam (Host) 
And then what? What gives that impression for you? I'm interested because I listened to it a couple of times and loved it, and then other ones stuck out at me. So I'm interested to see. 
 
05:32 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, I honestly I just got hooked on the melody lines of the vocalists. So, yeah, for me that was just earworm. Again, we know that I'm a bit more of a lyric girly, but actually it was the melodies that actually stood out to me. Again, earwormies, they got stuck in there. 
 
05:52 - Sam (Host)
Great. 
 
05:53 - Alexis (Host)
A little groove, groove, groove, groove. 
 
05:55 - Sam (Host)
Yeah. 
 
05:56 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, but this track features Lace XL, who I believe is also based up on the east coast up in Queensland as well. So yeah, again, it just really highlights diving into community and doing a project like a collective, like yeah, I really do love that. 
 
06:22 - Sam (Host)
And I think as well, the majority of the artists on the record are First Nations if I’m not mistaken. 
 
06:33 - Alexis (Host)
Actually, I haven't delved into that side of things, so perhaps you are right. 
 
06:38 - Sam (Host)
Maybe, maybe. It's been a while, and you know, what we could do is we could actually get in contact with them, which would be very cool, which I haven't done yet. 
 
06:48 - Alexis (Host)
We definitely could do that. I love this. 
 
06:50 - Sam (Host)
We'll get in touch with Bedroom Suck as well and ask them. 
 
06:53 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, yeah. Well, I remember when I was diving into this. I remember just loving the fact that I think they all met up together in Adelaide, because they're not all based out of Adelaide, but I think they all met up together in Adelaide. Now we're coming up with the concept. 
 
07:14
Yeah, oh that's so cute. And then look for those listening and for those following the potty. I am half Filipino, so for me, whenever I hear like an origin story of like a project which this one, they all came together in Adelaide and they like shared food, of like Ethiopian food and like came up with the concept of this. 
 
07:36 - Sam (Host)
That's incredible. 
 
07:37 - Alexis (Host)
So like for me, just like community and ideas, just around food is just like I'm, like you're talking to the sister spirit here. I'm all for it. I'm all for it, love it. 
 
07:52 - Sam (Host)
This is going to turn into a food podcast in season three, but we're not telling anyone that yet. Shh shh. 
 
07:57 - Alexis (Host)
Let them come down the rabbit hole a bit further. 
 
07:59 - Sam (Host)
This is going to turn into a food podcast in season three, but we're not telling anyone that yet. Let them come down the rabbit hole a bit further. I have to say I love the fact that you got caught on melody in this, because I got caught on a lyric again. 
 
08:06 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my God, stop. I'm so proud of you. Look at you go. 
 
08:10 - Sam (Host)
The whole B-side of the record, the whole Sunset side, has this and it's not just an ongoing idea about talking about Sunset. They actually say when was the last time you saw the Sunset and it begins and ends majority of the tracks on the B side, which I thought was really cool. But then the hot pick for me was 626, because just they brought the entire that side of the record together and a bit more spoken word rather than actual written rhyme, which I thought was really cool. And one of the lines there that just said my dad would say sun comes up, sun goes down. 
 
08:54
Simple but kind of profound, I would think, is the line yeah, kind of simple but kind of profound I would think is the line yeah, kind of simple but kind of profound oh my god, there were a few lyrics through that whole side of the record that are really cool yeah I think it was if I would have to find it written down but there's one there that was I used. I call my little brother son because he shone like one. If I misheard that, I apologise, but that's how I heard it and I love it. 
 
09:27 - Alexis (Host)
Well, do you know what? For those listening, you go down your little rabbit hole and listen to the record and let us know if we're wrong. 
 
09:34 - Sam (Host)
Exactly Post a TikTok of misheard lyrics. How about that? 
 
09:40 - Alexis (Host)
There's a reason why that's popular. 
 
09:42 - Sam (Host)
That's very true. So yeah, so your favourite is 626, the last track on the entire album. 
 
09:49 - Alexis (Host)
Perfect. I think that's great. 
 
09:52 - Sam (Host)
Closely followed by the opening track of the album. Only because and I was so excited about 626 that I've lost the title of it I'm going to look over here and cheat. Just that beginning. So that dimension, first track of A-side. It's called that Dimension. Also, look at the back of the art as well. That artwork's beautiful, mainly because that first moment of putting this thing on the feeling was just oh, thank you. 
 
10:29 - Alexis (Host)
And, I'll be honest, I don't listen to nearly enough hip hop. So it was really lovely for me to have such a rounded record to listen to where, like I didn't feel overwhelmed, my ears didn't feel cooked at any point there was enough light and shade across both sides of this vinyl that I felt engaged the whole entire time. 
 
10:53 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, the beat making and production was really considered and really really musical yeah, so real cool. 
 
11:00 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, it was really really well done. 
 
11:07 - Sam (Host)
Really hits the soul. There's some stuff in there that made me feel like I was on venice beach in california. Almost I was just like no, no we're but that feel, that sunset feeling of just ah, ah, chills. Just peace. There's a reason why when you're in Western Australia, every hill and every beach there's 10 minutes. Every hill and every beach in Western Australia is covered in people when you can see the sunset. 
 
11:33 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, yeah, because it's a vibe. It's a vibe. 
 
11:38 - Sam (Host)
Well, we've done our 10-minute wrap. We're done to it. That's not a sentence. Whatever. We're done to it. 
 
11:47 - Alexis (Host)
Get onto Sunset Cities. 
 
11:50 - Sam (Host)
Absolutely Still available on Bandcamp. 
 
11:53 - Alexis (Host)
Yes, go, please support. 
 
11:55 - Sam (Host)
Let's look right now 14 remaining. Yeah 14 remaining, get on. 
 
12:01 - Alexis (Host)
Get amongst it! 
 
12:04 - Sam (Host)
At time of recording. 
 
12:05 - Alexis (Host)
Love it. 
 
12:06 - Sam (Host)
Out of an addition of 500. This is the 12-inch LP. 
 
12:10 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, beautiful. Yeah, All right brother, until next time. 
 
12:14 - Sam (Host)
See you very soon. 
 
12:21 - Alexis (Host)
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom. Forward slash through the creative door or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favorite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

3 | You’ve Got To Make Space For Play with James and Bronnie

In this episode, Alexis is joined by James and Bronnie, the talented duo behind the Melbourne-based band Curly and the Fringe. Alongside their music careers, James is an accomplished photographer and videographer, while Bronnie is a freelance writer. They dive into their creative journeys, discussing how they balance their individual artistic passions with their music career, their approach to songwriting, and the challenges of working in multiple creative fields. The conversation also highlights the importance of play in creativity, reminding us that as adults, it’s easy to lose sight of the joy that comes with creating without the pressure of perfection. Whether you’re an artist or someone trying to juggle different creative pursuits, this episode offers valuable insights into finding harmony and success in the creative world.
 
If you’d like to see more, you can follow James & Bronnie on instagram; @curlyandthefringe
 
This episode was recorded on 11 January 2025 on the lands of the Woiworung Peoples. We hope that this episode inspires you as a creative person and as a human being.
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for creative people to share their story and inspire others. Have you got someone in mind who would love to have a chat? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
…
Creative resources
Scar Tissue by Anthony Kiedis
On Writing: A Memoir of the Craft by Stephen King
Alan Watts
How Proust Can Change Your Life - Alain de Botton
Let’s get social:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/throughthecreativedoor/ 
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ttcdpodcast
 
CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
 
—--------------------------
00:09 - Alexis (Host)
Hello, my name is Alexis Naylor and I am your host here at Through the Creative Door. On behalf of myself and my guests, I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. Owners and custodians on which this podcast is recorded and produced. May we pay our respects to all First Nations people and acknowledge Elders, past and present. On this podcast, I'll be chatting to an array of creative guests, getting a glimpse into their worlds and having some honest and inspiring conversations along the way. I'm delighted to welcome you to Through the Creative Door
Hello, James and Bonnie, how are you? 
 
00:52 - James (Guest)
Good. 
 
00:53 - Bronnie (Guest) 
Tremendous Just delicious. 
 
00:56 - Alexis (Host)
I love this. I am so bloody chuffed. I look at you, you bloody power, couple you two. 
 
01:03 - James (Guest)
We do often tally each other. We're like, we're a power couple
 
01:05 - Bronnie (Guest)
But like ironically, because we're not really, I don't think. 
 
01:13 - James (Guest)
We don't really achieve that much. We, you know micro wins every day. 
 
01:17 - Bronnie (Guest)
Again, it depends on your definition of success. 
 
01:22 - Alexis (Host)
That's true. That's true. But for those that are listening, you guys have a cutie patootie, folk slash. What else would you call that? 
 
01:30 - James (Guest)
We're a folk duo on paper, but then we sometimes have a very alternative loud rock band
 
01:44 - Bronnie (Guest)
We're kind of genre sluts. So we like to. We've got one really punk song, one kind of garage stoner rock song. 
 
01:52 - Alexis (Host)
Yep, oh yeah, sorry, I forgot to say Curly in the Fringe. 
 
01:56 - James (Guest)
Curly in the Fringe. 
 
01:57 - Alexis (Host)
That's right, curly in the Fringe Whoop, whoop, whoop In the house. 
 
02:01 - Bronnie (Guest)
All right, let's get into it. I'm excited, let's go, All right. 
 
02:05 - Alexis (Host)
Bron yes, what does a creative space mean to you, and why?
 
02:10 - Bronnie (Guest)
Well, I actually responded more to the second part of this question, which was about how your mindset has changed. Is that right, yeah? okay, if I speak to that. 
 
02:22 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, 100%. 
 
02:22 - Bronnie (Guest)
I didn't know that I was a creative person for a long time until maybe sort of about five years ago, which is really funny when you look back, because I tried to have the corporate job for about four years at the start of my career and I just did not fit in at all and my one of my first jobs was working in like accounts management for an advertising company and the creatives were on the floor below us and and I just much more kind of you wanted to be there spiritually like gelled with those people because they were because I'm not a normie, right, and I tried, I tried really hard to be a normie for um, up until I was about 29 ish. 
 
03:15
So, yeah, I was trying to fit in all through school. I was trying to fit in with kind of the, the jock group and I played netball and they didn't like me right no, but they didn't. It didn't work at all, it just wasn't. I realize now that I should have been hanging out with, like, the artists and the weirdos and and those are my people, um, because those are the people who are much more kind of authentic, they think about things, they feel, whereas the jock group that I was trying to fit in with. They had a very particular kind of system and way of communicating and set of values that didn't match up with my own, so they didn't like me. They ditched me and bullied me. Fast forward to the career, trying to be a suit and a business person. It's not working out. 
 
04:18
And then I went freelance and I was a writer and I still didn't know that I was a creative person, even though I was a writer. Because still didn't know that I was a creative person even though I was a writer. Because I didn't know that writing was a creative thing really, because it just came so naturally to me I didn't think about it and then sort of yeah, started to realize get to know myself better. When you're 30 plus, it's so good. Oh, how good is being 30 plus I love, yeah, I totally love yeah um, suddenly you accept yourself a whole lot more. 
 
04:51
You're like, hey, it's okay that I don't want to go out and do the stuff that other people are doing. It's okay to like what I like. Um, so all of this is to say that, yeah, I didn't realise I was a creative person and now I'm really trying to learn how to um turn it into a career and be disciplined with it, because I'm really bad with being driven by motivation and inspiration rather than habit and values, which means that I'm not very prolific in terms of creating things. I spend a lot of time sort of on the couch. I call it Bronwy. I suffer from Bronwy constantly and I just like I'm tired all the time. I think I've had a lot of depression and anxiety over the years, probably from trying to force myself to be someone that I wasn't, and that's exhausting. So here we are. 
 
05:55 - Alexis (Host)
How about you, James? 
 
05:59 - James (Guest)
What does a creative space mean to you and why? Well, I've created when I'm anxious and when I'm feeling present and feeling good, and the art that comes out is just different. I think Anxious art's cool. It's like chaotic and just yeah, I don't know, depends on, yeah, I don't know. I always come back to good art and bad art but, like, sometimes I can't express myself. Like I've been writing this song for 10 years 10 years probably and the music is awesome, but the lyrics, like I've written it probably 20 times and I'm like Bronnie, just fucking, can you write it for me? She's like get me a break. Word Smith come on, and at the time that was a song that was, like you know, traumatic event happens and then the music is like based on that, but the words, the words can't. 
 
06:59 - Bronnie (Guest)
But music is also the primary way that you express yourself. 
 
07:03 - James (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, so that's, yeah, yeah. 
 
07:05 - Bronnie (Guest)
And I like to question whether we always need words. Like why are we trying to force it to be something? 
 
07:14 - James (Guest)
It's funny because I muted the vocal track. 
 
07:16 - Bronnie (Guest)
Yeah, and. 
 
07:17 - James (Guest)
I was like this music's awesome, yeah. But then I'm like attached to that singer-songwriter. I want to be fucking Dylan or whatever and yeah, just like I'm not doing dylan comma bob yeah yeah, um 
 
07:22 - Alexis (Host)
But you think about the times when you hear songs in another language where we don't actually know what they're saying yeah, it hits, it hits yeah, you're right it does. 
 
07:44 - James (Guest)
Yeah, one thing going back to that initial question in a physical creative space, it's pretty awesome to be playing guitar in a room that's clean. 
 
07:55 - Alexis (Host)
As in, no clutter?
 
07:56 - James (Guest)
No clutter, because then you just get distracted by things. I could put that away, or no, you know. 
 
08:09 - Bronnie (Guest)
Interestingly, I totally agree with you. I need a clean, organized space. But, there's some studies that suggest that messy people who have messy spaces tend to be more creative apparently. 
 
08:25 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, speaking of humans, is there something that you're proud of creating thus far? 
 
08:37 - Bronnie (Guest)
I think all the songs that I've written with James I am actually really proud of because they were challenging. As I said, I didn't see myself as a creative person. I really, when I was younger I wanted to be a singer, but then I had one sister who whenever I would sing there's always one she would say you're out of tune, Bronwyn. Like every single time I'd just be singing quietly in my room and she'd call out you're out of tune, Bronwyn. And now I know that she was just being shitty and sisterly, um, but at the time it was really really shook me because I was like, oh, clearly I can't hear, or whatever, or, and again it stopped me from playing and exploring because I was like it's wrong air quotes, right, um. So then I got really shy and didn't trust myself and everything. 
 
09:37
And James is the one who kept encouraging me and and I got to 29 or whatever, and I was like what am I doing with my life? Like you know, I want to try to maybe do some of these things that I've dreamed of, that I've been too scared of. So I started playing around on the piano and singing a bit and it was rough at the start but, yeah, then we started kind of writing together and James kept me really honest. James has a really good eye for and I hate the language that I'm going to use, but I'm going to say like true art, and by that I mean something that comes from a really natural, genuine, authentic place, and so he'll show me things sometimes that I've put online and and there's a song um cash savage and the last drinks and and there's this music video that goes with it and it's called what's it called? 
um working, keep working on you keep working on your job, working at your job yeah, it's fantastic, it's just, it's so. And he's the first one who kind of showed me the chats and and yeah. And then obviously there's the other side of that where sometimes he shows me some things and we have a little bit of a giggle because the person's trying, but it's clearly they're trying too hard, it's not landing it's not a way that you would expect and people can tell I think people can really tell if it comes from a genuine place or not, or if you're kind of cutting corners and skipping some of the process, you know, just farting out lyrics or whatever, and they don't quite land. 
 
11:27
So yeah, I also started kind of being a bit lazy with my lyrics at the start, as you do when you're first songwriting. You're just kind of filling in lines, I think, think, and James would pull me up and sort of say that's a cliche or that doesn't kind of ring true. And yeah, he kept me really honest and, um, I really genuinely love all the songs, as much as I'm my own biggest critic and and like, find my voice hard to listen to, especially at the start, and I focus on all the flaws and everything. I then hear back the songs a couple of months later or something and I think, oh, actually, yeah, that's nice, those words are nice or funny or you know, and the music is always good because that's you. 
 
12:13 - Alexis (Host)
How about you how about you? How about you, james? Have you got something that sort of resonates with you as like a proud project or creative thing? 
 
12:23 - James (Guest)
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean, I achieve. I can do things Like. I'm always doing stuff. 
 
12:30 - James (Guest)
Every video that I put out. Sometimes I look back at them on instagram. I'm like fucking deleting that. Yeah, it's oh rough, but at the time I thought it was great. Um, yeah, the songs will be right, like all the songs that we songs that get mastered like. I'm always like, yeah, they're sweet, they can stay up again. I've deleted songs off spotify from my 20s and I'm like, oh yeah, deleting that. Um, you know, art is life too. I used to play sport, so cricket and football, and we won like these premierships, right, but especially this football, like football in Benalla under 18s. It's like three years of training for this moment, basically, and like team building and bonding and like training twice a week and so that was fucking cool, actually playing in a premiership side. I know this is like not music. 
 
13:43 - Bronnie (Guest)
You can totally do sport as a work of art. You absolutely can there are people shane warren, may he rest in peace. Yeah, absolutely, like made bowling into an art form. He did it his own way, so I the art of spin bowling yeah. 
 
13:53 - James (Guest)
So I do really like that as well and I was like a passionate cricketer and stuff. 
 
13:59 - Alexis (Host)
How did you get into cricket, did someone?
 
14:02 - James (Guest)
I had no choice, because my dad and my brother just was there. My older brother and my dad were insane cricketers. Yeah, brother and my dad were insane cricketers, yeah, um, so yeah, there's like accolades and fucking stuff like that. I mean even as simple as like bronnie, and I do cover gigs, like you know two to five at ramblers on a sunday afternoon pretty cool place to play music. 
 
14:33
It's like a brewery and oh, shout out to beautiful ben leslie and like we, just simple stuff like getting dressed, putting your best clothes on. You go do yoga in the morning, go for a run and then we leave at 10 to 1. It's just around the corner and that means I get there 50 minutes before we start so I get to set up slowly. Ben's really cool. We play music for three hours and sometimes the hanging out with ben and just chatting with people there is more fun than playing the music part. 
 
15:13 - Alexis (Host)
But it's just how good is your band family yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah so amazing yeah community community
 
15:29 - James (Guest)
So I really love um team like achieving the team. I can't think of a better word than achieve, but like proud of the collective yeah, collective or um collaboration, yeah, harmonizing even um, anyway, going back to that ramblers cover gig, and then we get home and we've like we fucking did it and we made 450 bucks and we're like we got fed, now we're sitting on the couch watered yeah, good, yeah. Sitting on the couch watching succession and we're like fucking cats are inside. How good's this, you know? This is the life yeah, this is a good life yeah 
 
16:07 - Bronnie (Guest)
what question are you answering? can I just ask? Well, I was answering, basically. 
 
16:14 - James (Guest)
Going back to the initial answer, For those listening, these guys got to read the questions beforehand. 
 
16:17 - Bronnie (Guest)
Guess who did go through and prepare, and guess who, I'm pretty sure did not. 
 
16:26 - James (Guest)
Well, wasn't the question what are you proud of? What are you most proud of?
 
16:29 - Bronnie (Guest)
No, you're doing so well. I'm sorry, don't? I love you. 
 
16:36 - Alexis (Host)
There's no shame, no shame on this podcast. Your answers are super valid. Well, I guess, on the flip side of things that we're most proud of, I'm going to go with you, Bron. First, do you think that there's been something or like a circumstance or experience or a time in your life that has been like had a direct um challenging impact on creating? 
 
17:11 - Bronnie (Guest)
yeah for sure. Um, back in 2021, I had a massive panic attack. I'd actually had a couple. It was in and out of lockdown, stressful socio-political environment. Everything was kind of like going to shit. And um, I was dealing with that by numbing out smoking pot, taking psychedelics, having a wonderful time. But, um, overdoing it definitely. Um self-medicating and cut to massive panic attack. Two hours on the ground, ambulance came fully thought I was having a heart attack and dying. 
 
18:00 - Alexis (Host)
It's all right to laugh now. 
 
18:02 - Bronnie (Guest)
It's funny now Because I was there right. 
 
18:06 - James (Guest)
I called the ambulance. 
 
18:08 - Bronnie (Guest)
But then what happens is I'm actually really interested in psychology, so that was all happening and it was terrifying and terrible, but there was a part of me going. This is interesting. What's going on here, um, and I started learning all about like anxiety and stimulation and panic and and. When you've been through a lot of stress for a long time or one gigantic, very stressful, very traumatic experience, what happens is you're getting all this stress hormone released in your body right and it affects all these different organs, makes it more difficult for your brain to maintain homeostasis and I'm very sketchy on science but I'm pretty good with psychology, so be a bit patient with me here. But anyway, what happens is you end up in a state of hyperstimulation or semi-stress response readiness, and what that basically means is all these organs that are affected by stress and systems in your body are starting to behave erratically because your stimulation levels have risen consistently, that they've reset at a higher spot and, as I said, your brain's having trouble maintaining homeostasis. So you're getting all these like little kind of um tingles in your arm and in your scalp and you're getting like tightness in the chest and you're very jump. You'll find you're very jumpy, um, and because I'd had such an enormous panic attack. 
 
19:46
Um, I went through about three, four, five months of hyperstimulation where I was just like terrified all the time. I constantly thought I was dying, about to have a stroke. Something was off, um, and it made it really hard to create, because when you're anxious, your focus narrows. It's like you're running away from a T-Rex You've become very focused on. You're not like relaxed and thinking about things from a macro sense, you're very much like what's right in front of me. 
 
20:24 - James (Guest)
Yeah, you're on basic mode. 
 
20:26 - Bronnie (Guest)
James calls it basic mode, which I love, survival mode, and it's a beautiful thing. 
 
20:35
It was very, very challenging and and and a tough time and um, one of the things that taught me was, during this time where I was not much fun, probably to be around for James. We were going for one of our nightly walks and it was hard rubbish and there was this tricycle out the front of a kindergarten, like a daycare, that had a squeaky wheel but was otherwise kind of basically functional, and I have no idea why, but I jumped onto it and I was careening around the streets on this tiny little tricycle with this squeaky wheel and it was just fun, right. It was just like silly, spontaneous play Immediately felt so much better and lighter and that was one of the first times where I started to think, hey, play right. Play is so important and as we get older I think a lot of us tend not to do it so much. We get more stuck in our ways and routines and, yeah, how can I maintain sort of a youthful outlook, an open mind, being more present to what's around me rather than just taking everything for granted? 
 
21:52 - Alexis (Host)
Do you need an object. Do you have anything that either of you like a lucky socks or I? 
 
22:02 - Bronnie (Guest)
Ooh superstition. 
 
22:04 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, like I mean, let's go all out, or is there just? 
 
22:10 - James (Guest)
I don't know. I don't know. 
 
22:12 - Bronnie (Guest)
Not really. I think is the answer Not really yeah, your guitar. 
 
22:15 - James (Guest)
Well, I need a guitar. 
 
22:16 - Bronnie (Guest)
Yeah. 
 
22:19 - James (Guest)
I mean the outcome's better if I prepare Absolutely Headspace I mean meditation, makes the creative session much better. What about you? 
 
22:34 - Bronnie (Guest)
If I'm writing an article or doing yoga or cooking, I need um, I've got to have music. Yeah, that's that's. 
 
22:46 - James (Guest)
I've got to have like a podcast going on whilst I'm walking or something. Yeah, which um which is funny, because you don't need it really. 
 
22:56 - Bronnie (Guest)
You don't need it and maybe it would be beneficial to not have it. 
 
23:02 - James (Guest)
But we do. 
 
23:02 - Alexis (Host)
But maybe you're stimulating multiple senses at once. That help. 
 
23:06 - Bronnie (Guest)
I do it for relaxation, so I put on Calming Classical often when I'm writing just to kind of yeah, you know get you into your body a bit and out of your mind, which is helpful. And when I'm doing yoga, I curate a bunch of yoga playlists. If you're into yoga, my profile is LeBronLA. We'll put it in the show notes. Yeah, and there's a ton of. 
 
23:34 - James (Guest)
There's some banging playlists. 
 
23:35 - Bronnie (Guest)
There's some. And well thought out yeah, very carefully curated, to bring you up into your body and then bring you down again, um, for shavasana at the end, um, but yeah, in terms of if I'm doing, I don't have an object, I don't think, my brain, my heart and senses- Maybe not so much a material object, but yeah. Yeah, I don't think so yeah. 
 
24:03 - Alexis (Host)
All right, if you could give one piece of advice, one nugget of gold to another creative, what would it be? 
 
24:14 - Bronnie (Guest)
Okay, I'm going to speak as if I'm speaking to myself, because I need to hear this as much as anybody. 
 
24:20 - James (Guest)
Yeah good point. I love that.  
 
24:23 - Bronnie (Guest)
I would say trust your own judgment. So explore, play, be open to feedback, but say to yourself like is there anything in this that could help me express this idea better or that could help me make this better? If you like it the way it is, go with it. The way it is because ultimately it's about self-expression. Yeah, it's about self-expression, yeah and um. It doesn't matter if other people like it or respond to it. I think if you're genuinely expressing something, I think chances are people there will be people out there who do see that and recognize that. 
 
25:11
But I think we have this hyper productivity, focused hustle culture where we feel like we need to produce and it's only worth while to do art if other people are hearing it or listening or seeing it or celebrating it. Right, if we're, what's the point? If we're not Beyonce, but no, I think, do more art, it's. It's how you get to know yourself. Um, it's cathartic and it's good therapy it's good therapy. How? 
 
There's no wrong, there's no, it's yeah yeah, there's no, you're not gonna please everyone's a critic. You're not gonna please everybody, so just follow your own 
 
25:56 - Alexis (Host) 
yeah, absolutely how about you, James? 
 
26:00 - James (Guest)
um, I like the idea of talking to myself, as in giving advice to myself, because again I need to hear this. But, um, someone who's had um trouble with self-doubt and confidence in myself, um, try and find the root of why you are doubting yourself all the time, because I find like my own inner narrative is negative. My output isn't as prolific, I guess, or whatever. So we're all riddled with it. But I think try and find a way to believe in yourself and have fun. 
 
26:45 - Bronnie (Guest)
Our inner critic often has the voice of our parents which we don't necessarily recognize. But yeah, try to go back to that childlike mindset of I'm just exploring and playing and and um, following my interests. 
 
27:02 - James (Guest)
You watch all these like child prodigies, like, uh, fucking. I don't know if anyone knows nathan cavalieri or um alex turnerkeys. He's a fucking monster man Like 14, 15, just writing these beasts of songs. 
 
27:22 - Bronnie (Guest)
Yeah. 
 
27:25 - James (Guest)
And he's just playing. You can hear it and there's no wrong.
 
27:29 - Bronnie (Guest)
You can hear it in the Arctic Monkeys' first album, especially how much fun they're having and it's clearly. It just sounds good to them, right, yeah? Yeah, and it's clearly it just sounds good to them right? 
 
27:38 - James (Guest)
Yeah, Absolutely. 
 
27:39 - Bronnie (Guest)
The other thing I would say that I need to hear again is enjoy the process, so try not to force it or be in a hurry to finish it. Let the idea develop. You know, keep coming back to it. That was a piece of advice I got um in in oh yeah, early writing job just keep coming back to it, let it develop, you know, let the seed kind of germinate. 
 
28:16 - James (Guest)
I have one, one piece of advice that um, I guess a mentor, Sean Gardner. He's not with us anymore, but he said to me once kind of in passing but just finish the project and yeah keep going back, to keep coming back to it. Yeah, always try and finish the project. You don't have to release it. You don't know, I do a massive promo and PR campaign. 
 
28:39 - Alexis (Host)
But there's something about, yeah, getting through your process and finishing. Yeah, because then like, then you just, if you don't continue practising, finishing a project, whatever that looks like, then you just have a bunch of stuff that you've just written a verse and a chorus or you know, maybe you've only sketched it, or yeah, there's learnings in the doing right, that's a good one. 
 
29:06 - James (Guest)
Good question. 
 
29:08 - Alexis (Host)
Is there anything? Any books, podcasts, youtube? I don't know any resource that has helped your creative process, Any references? 
 
29:24 - Bronnie (Guest)
Ones that aren't like obvious resources would be like meditating, journaling, the Enneagram Fuck Yes, Rick Rubin does a podcast where he talks with Andrew Huberman, but I'm sure he did a bunch of other podcasts when he was spruiking his book about creativity. 
 
29:45 - James (Guest)
Yeah, that's a good point. Actually, I'm reading a book about the Eagles at the moment and it's just like I guess, no specific podcast, but reading a lot of or listening to audio books about biographies of musicians and stuff like scar tissue by um anthony ketis yeah it's a good 
 
30:11 - Bronnie (Guest)
One on writing by um stephen king. It's really good. Alan watts, I mean, I get super into him and he talks a lot about um Ruay, which is this Taoist principle of not forcing yeah, that actually is something he's informed a lot of my thinking um around. 
 
30:32
You know he talks about, so the healing virtues of a plant, right? So they're not trying to be. We think of virtue as something that you kind of aspire to or like, as opposed to it just being innately in you, totally innately in you, like um. So raspberry leaf tea is meant to be tummy settling or you know whatever, and it's that's just, it's innate property's innate property. So, um, I love that idea. So again, coming back to what I've all been saying about following your interests and what lights you up, and um, yes, there was another one. 
 
31:08
Oh, alan de botton, he's fabulous. He wrote um how proust can change your life, and that's a lot about creativity, the art of travel yeah gosh, there's so many. Love it. 
 
31:23 - Alexis (Host)
All right. One last question. If you could hear another creative come on this podcast and answer these questions, who would it be? 
 
31:32 - James (Guest)
Evan's fun? Evan Jones from Malibu Spacey. Oh, evan Jones is fun. Yeah, he's good chess, he just gets into it. He also loves cooking and songwriting. Yeah. 
 
31:47 - Bronnie (Guest)
I would say we call him Pirate Craig, but his name is Craig Johnson and he performs under the name Del Cinqui. And just because he's a wonderful storyteller, yeah, he's fucking funny. He's really funny and engaging and interesting. So, I think he'd be fabulous. 
 
32:09 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, my goodness, James, Bronnie, this has been so bloody glorious. Thank you so much for coming through the creative door and having a chat with us. It's, yeah, just been glorious Love it, thanks for having us that was fun. 
32:29 - Alexis (Host)
Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom. Forward slash through the creative door or via the link in our Instagram bio where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favourite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye. 

BSIDE Tattoo You

Featured Artist: The Rolling Stones
Featured Vinyl: Tattoo You
Alexis' Hot Pick 
Tops 
Sam's Hot Pick 
Heaven 
Thanks for listening, catch you on the next episode.
Psst! We are always on the lookout for an artist's vinyl to listen to, have you got one in mind that we should check out? Get in contact with us via Instagram @throughthecreativedoor
 
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CREDITS
Created and Hosted by Alexis Naylor
Co-Host: Sam Timmerman
Music by Alexis Naylor & Ruby Miguel
Voiceover: Ruby Miguel
Edited and Produced by Ruby Miguel
00:09 - 
Welcome to B-Side, the mini-series from Through the Creative Door. Join Alexis and Sam as they dive into the timeless world of vinyl. For Alexis, vinyl was more than music. It was a Sunday ritual she shared with her dad, listening, talking and soaking in the stories behind each album and the artwork on every sleeve. Though her dad is no longer with us, she continues this tradition with her friend, sam Timmerman. Join them as they share their passion for vinyl and the stories these records hold. 
00:44 - Alexis (Host)
Hello brother. 
 
00:46 - Sam (Host)
Hello, hello, it's good to see you. It's good to see you. I just found this that I've been looking for forever. 
 
00:52 - Alexis (Host)
What is it? 
 
00:53 - Sam (Host)
It's a guitar pick. I'm not very good at guitar, but I was gifted some guitar picks. 
 
00:58 - Alexis (Host)
I mean trusty little contraption that everyone should have in their toolbox. 
 
01:03 - Sam (Host)
Fender 75th. I just found it. 
 
01:12 - Alexis (Host)
I love it, so let's do episode 2. 
 
01:17 - Sam (Host)
Episode 2. 
 
01:18 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah of talking about vinyls. I love this for us. I'm going to start our timer. We've got 10 minutes. 
 
01:26 - Sam (Host)
Boom, no pressure. What have you got for us? 
 
01:29 - Alexis (Host)
No pressure, I have this bad boy Rolling Stones Tattoo you Ooh ooh. 
 
01:37 - Intro (None)
It is. 
 
01:38 - Alexis (Host)
Look at this Green, Green back red front Nick and Keith right. Yeah, yeah, this was an album cover that won the Grammy Award in 1982 for best album package. 
 
01:56 - Sam (Host)
The cover itself won. I did not know that, yeah. 
 
01:58 - Alexis (Host)
That's very cool. Yeah, because it's super fancy. No one quite knew that that was them on the cover. 
 
02:07 - Sam (Host)
Oh yeah, that was the thing. People didn't know who the person on the cover was. 
 
02:11 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, exactly Exactly, which is sick. I love it. I love it yeah. 
 
02:16 - Sam (Host)
Did you say 72? It won the Grammy 1982? 82. I didn't even listen. Yeah, it's really cool. Yeah, my first ever Rolling Stones album I've listened to top to bottom. 
 
02:30 - Alexis (Host)
I'm sorry what I'm not judging, but I'm a little bit judging. It's all right. We just opened this world for you, Sam, it's fine. It's fine, all right. Well, popping the Rolling Stones, cherry, what was your top pick? 
 
02:48 - Sam (Host)
You'll love this. It was the one that sounded what I think sounded the least like classic Stones. I've heard plenty of their tracks before, but I had not listened to an entire album top to bottom, and all of a sudden, Heaven came out of nowhere and I just went. This is cool. I went into my ambient to an entire album, top to bottom, and all of a sudden heaven came out of nowhere and I just went. 
 
03:13
This is cool. I went, went into my ambient state and I loved it. Oh, ambient sound really cool, was not expecting it and just the the amount of the amount of soundscape in that track compared to the rest of the album was just out of left field and fantastic. It was really cool yeah do you know? What I've got a deep dive of bob clear mountain, which we'll talk about in a second because you've got a question. 
 
03:36 - Alexis (Host)
Well, what else was the like? What else was the cherry on top boy of Heaven as a top um? 
 
03:47 - Sam (Host)
Look, I have to look at it again because I've forgotten the very few lyrics that are in there, because I was listening to some other cool stuff as well. 
 
03:55 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. 
 
03:56 - Sam (Host)
But just the lyrics being so simple and
 
04:06 - Alexis (Host)
 but you're not normally a lyrics man. That's usually my job. I'm meant to be a lyrics girl. 
 
04:09 - Sam (Host)
All of the listening I did in this was all about lyrics for some reason. It's a little bit. The first line's a little bit creepy, but you know I don't think it's actually meant to be creepy. It is beautiful, but first line's interesting. After that it's very cool. Like senses be praised is kind of fun. The first line is what it's the smell of you, what, yeah, the smell of you, baby, my senses, my senses be praised, which on its own is either really beautiful or quite creepy. 
 
04:40
When you listen to the music it's poetic so, so embedded into the sound that you don't necessarily listen to the lyrics too much, so I had to look them up. It was very cool. No one will harm you. No one will stand in your way. 
 
04:57 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, that's a good line. 
 
04:58 - Sam (Host)
It's beautiful. 
 
04:59 - Alexis (Host)
That is a good line. 
 
05:01 - Sam (Host)
I did enjoy that. What was yours? 
 
05:04 - Alexis (Host)
Tops was my favourite track, but can I have an honourable mention? 
 
05:12 - Sam (Host)
You have done in the past, so we'll allow it okay, great. 
 
05:15 - Alexis (Host)
Um Slave is just like super close second for me why is it a close second? 
 
05:23 - Sam (Host)
because we're going to talk about tops in a minute. Why is Slave a close second? 
 
05:26 - Alexis (Host)
oh, I just it has. It's just got this vibe. That's just like such an anthem, oh yeah. 
 
05:34 - Sam (Host)
Are you talking about the lyrics? 
 
05:36 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, well, the whole thing, both Tops and Slave. It's earworms, they just like get stuck in there. 
 
05:43 - Sam (Host)
See, Slave got me because it grooved so hard. It was really hard. 
 
05:47 - Alexis (Host)
Yes hard to groove. Yeah, I thought you'd. 
 
05:50 - Sam (Host)
I thought that would be your top pick actually well, like you said, I would have ignored the lyrics completely and gone. This sounds great exactly yeah, for those listening and watching. If you ever hear me talk about lyrics, it's rare, because these are is it? 
 
06:03 - Alexis (Host)
this is so rare? Music yes yeah, exactly, I'm the lyric girl. You're not so much, we're getting there. 
 
06:14 - Sam (Host)
There are some other albums for later in the season, that yeah. 
 
06:19 - Intro (None)
I love this. 
 
06:20 - Sam (Host)
Mm-hmm. but Tops, because I didn't. Honestly, I only listened through Tops once, so you'll have to describe to me more about what made that your top pick oh,
 
06:26 - Alexis (Host)
I really see this is gonna I'm not gonna, uh, explain it very well, but it's almost like, though, just the vibe, it, just from the minute that it comes in, from the minute it finishes, it has my full attention yeah yeah, full attention, and that's like lyrics and musically the arrangements. It's just yeah, fully has me and I'm like in it, love that that's fantastic yeah yeah, very cool. 
 
07:07 - Sam (Host)
Now I've gone a little bit of a deep dive deep dive, go, go go Heaven um, because, noticing that heaven as a track, specifically names bob clear mountain as the mixer and one of the engineers on the record. 
 
07:23
So I went that's a cool little thing to add in, and shame on me having never heard this guy's name before, because there's a quote from I think it's sound on Sound Magazine that says he has his name on more pop records. What is it? No, he has his name on more hit records than any other person in history and yeah
 
07:48
So I went okay, let. Okay, let's go Now. Wikipedia shout out make sure you donate to Wikipedia because they are still free. Please donate. I don't know if the tax deductible I hope it is, but either way, donate to Wikipedia, not sponsored. He is nominated, I believe, for 10 Grammys as a mixer engineer for live recordings. He's won three, and he's won two Emmys on six nominations for live mixes of concerts that are televised. Like this, dude was the live sound engineer in Live Aid the original Live Aid. 
 
08:29 - Alexis (Host)
Yeah, see, look, that's Oliver. 
 
08:32 - Sam (Host)
And then he won, nominated, won a Grammy in 2023. 
 
08:39 - Alexis (Host)
Wait, that's like somewhat recent. 
 
08:42 - Sam (Host)
His first nomination was 1995. And his last nomination he didn't win this one, I don't think. Hang on. No his last nomination was 2023. His first nomination was 1993, not 1995, for MTV Unplugged. 
 
09:04 - Alexis (Host)
Awesome. 
 
09:05 - Sam (Host)
That's in the Emmys, Grammys, first nomination, 92. Last nomination, again 2023. Corey Henry had him as his producer. 
 
09:16 - Alexis (Host)
Oh, not surprised, why wouldn't you? 
 
09:19 - Sam (Host)
So maybe I need to go and listen to that album again. Corey Henry, oh my god. 
 
09:26 - Alexis (Host)
Maybe that's for a future episode. 
 
09:29 - Sam (Host)
Live at the piano. Corey Henry, gotta get on it. 
 
09:32 - Alexis (Host)
All right, add it to the list,
 
09:34 - Sam (Host)
All you Australia, Snarky Puppy fans, get your tickets. Next year 10th anniversary, there’s another album. Let's go Albums everywhere. 
 
09:47 - Alexis (Host)
Add it to the list. 
 
09:50 - Sam (Host)
Yes, I've got another tangent. I got distracted, again. 
 
09:52 - Alexis (Host)
I love this. Do you know what? As a full album, though, I really liked the little dabbles of brass, like the bits of saxophone that got dubbed in. That's one of the reasons why Slave is like my second favourite. Yeah, we've got saxophones all over now Saxophone yeah, reasons why slave is like my second favourite. I just absolutely yeah, saxophone slave and in waiting on a friend. 
 
10:19 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, which I just listened to again about 20 minutes ago yeah, gorgeous, gorgeous, gorgeous song um just makes me want to learn brass. 
 
10:30 - Alexis (Host)
I don't need to add any more instruments to the repertoire. 
 
10:35 - Sam (Host)
You can learn whatever you want. 
 
10:37 - Alexis (Host)
Don't tempt me. Don't tempt me. 
 
10:40 - Sam (Host)
I will tempt you all you want. For those of you who know me as a musician, yeah, you dabble in all of the things, find something shiny and go and try it. That's how it works. 
 
10:50 - Alexis (Host)
I just pulled a pic out of nowhere upside down. Oh it's glorious. 
 
11:01 - Sam (Host)
But I love it. Welcome to the visual world of podcasts I love this. 
 
11:06 - Alexis (Host)
I love this.
 
11:09 - Sam (Host)
If you're listening and not watching. I just showed the camera at guitar pitch for the second time. 
 
11:14 - Alexis (Host)
I think it sums up our friendship quite well. 
 
11:18 - Sam (Host)
Yeah, I agree, but I don't know. Oh, show and tell right. 
 
11:21 - Alexis (Host)
Show and tell. You're like where's she going with this? 
 
11:24 - Sam (Host)
I agree, but I don't understand. 
 
11:28 - Alexis (Host)
It's time. 
 
11:29 - Sam (Host)
It's time, it's time, there we go. 
 
11:32 - Alexis (Host)
All right, my love, I will chat to you later. 
 
11:35 - Sam (Host)
We will speak to you again very shortly. Rolling Stones Tattoo You. 
 
11:40 - Alexis (Host)
I know what a banger Get it into your ears. Get it into the earworms. Earworms. 
 
11:46 - Sam (Host)
Okay, see you in episode three. 
 
11:49 - Alexis (Host) 
See you, brother. 
 
11:48 - Alexis (Host)
See you in episode three. See you, brother. Bye. Thanks for tuning in for another episode of Through the Creative Door. If you enjoy our episodes and find value in them, consider supporting us by making a donation. Just visit buymeacoffeecom. Forward slash through the creative door or via the link in our Instagram bio, where you can choose an amount and even write us a little message. Every little bit helps and we truly appreciate all of your support. But if you can't donate, no worries, you can still help us out by sharing our podcast with your friends and family and leaving a review on your favourite platform. Thanks so much for being part of our community. We'll catch you on the next episode. Bye.